SPP HICCUP

[Roscoe]

Oldhand, did you go out and swing with the dd coils or just test in one location? I found the DD coil balanced fine in one location but changed ground balance once you start using it.

Karl, try turning gb off in those locations the detector will not gb at all. The detector will make a high tone coming down but will auto tune to the ground if you leave the coil down and it will run fine (have you beached detected with it yet). If you can run a VLF in that location with no problems then it is hardly a challenge for a PI detector. The PI detector in those locations can not see the ground, its the same as running PI on the beach (recommend you go to beach). The SPP at the beach or should i say most beaches will not ground balance there because there is not enough mineral in the ground for the SPP to see it. The problem is that not all soil in a location is evenly mineralised and what happens is you ground balance in one location and then find the Gb out not to far away. This is common around towns especially sports ovals, play grounds etc. as a lot of soil has been filled in from other locations. Don't forget your minelab x-terra has auto ground tracking and you would not realize that the gb was changing so much. Go out with your x-terra next time in auto tracking and leave the ground balance screen up and watch how much the auto tracking changes as you sweep and move from one location to the next.

I have a feeling that this was happening to me when i used the dd coils. So i thought i will raise the Gain from 5 to 8 and see if the machine changed its habit of the gb going out, but it didn't it just got noisier. Then i thought hang on here if my mono coils are hiccuping at factory preset gain then there has to be enough mineral in the ground for the detector to see, so why isn't this DD coil working? So like you Karl i am bewildered whats going on, but i just wanted to fill you in on how different a pi detector is compared to your VLF in regards to ground conditions so you can work out whats going on with your detector with DD coils.

Well its got me beat about these DD coils.

 

[old hand]

Roscoe It was up the back of my block the ground is quite mineralized ,I just had a look at some other tests I did with some DDs and in that spot they just balanced at between 9 and 10 if you remember you referred to Regs chart.I will be out in the morning I will try some DDs there It will be interesting to see what the outcome will be .The only thing is there has been a DSE burn of their. But I have been using a mono out there so I will see how the DDs balance up, I thick you are most probably right with DD coils acting different from one spot to another ,That's what we are finding with the monos from one spot to another but we are getting the hiccup thanks john

 

[Roscoe]

Yeh, I thought that it might be the ground changing, but it couldn't be because i would of noticed it with my mono coil in the same location. I am starting to think the commander DD coil wiring is not compatible with the SPP.

 

[old hand]

Yes but I used 1 commander and 2 nugget finder
What size commander did you use if I have one that size I will test it .

 

[KarlS]

Roscoe, yes I agree with what you said about town parks. Although I don't use ground tracking, I just ground balance often, and seldom the GB difference in one park with X-terra is more then 10 points. That equals to 1 point on SPP. I don't go to the beach as it means 100km round trip and thru bad traffic.
What I would like to know, and Reg may know, what is actually happening with SPP when you auto balance by holding the coil down until high tone stops. Does it overide GB pot setting, and for how long. Let's say you auto balance and after short while you rise and lower the coil for whatever reason. Will that detune setting?
I have to add that I don't really have problem with SPP. Just testing it in park I picked up 22 bucks and silver Ring. And I was not really searching, just testing. But same as with my previous detectors I want to understand the beast, so I got confidence in it, that I will not walk over good target and miss it because wrong settings .
Karl

 

[Roscoe]

Karl, No the auto tune does not over ride GB setting. The auto tune resets the detector back to its threshold setting once a signal is passed. The ground is just a signal, just like a target and if the ground was constant the GB would not be necessary it would be covered by the auto tune. This is why some PI beach detectors have no GB control. The GB setting and auto tune work in conjunction to enable the detector to operate smoothly. I know you are an electronics engineering and i am sorry i can not explain to you what is going on inside with the electronics.

Karl, I understand its a long drive across Sydney to have a go at the beach. Sorry Karl i only said go to the beach so you experience how the auto tune works on the sand in benign ground and i just thought this would give you a better understanding of your beast.

Oldhand, I will wait your response when you give those DD coils a swing mate. I am very interested in your results.

Riveted my new shaft on tonight, just waiting for silicon to go off. The SPP looks pretty with the new straight shaft fella's. My control box cover came in also from the U.S its woodland camo, i tell yah this things going to be real flash now. :lol: The bloody vernier and Pot. did not arrive yet, but there is another plane that comes in tomorrow. I will put the detector back together tomorrow anyway so i can do the Hiccup video.

 

[Guest]

Hey Roscoe I'm looking forward to a picture of that straight shaft'' chop chop

 

[old hand]

Just got back the mono still was hiccupping but other than that it was OK
The DD 10X6 would not GB where I was detecting it just ran out up the 10 end of the scale .
As I have said before electronics are not my thing ,but can the 2 things be tied together some how
regards john

 

[Roscoe]

Thanks Oldhand, like i said the DD coils on the SPP run weird.

 

[old hand]

I like the video hope they help people can see what we are talking about regards john

 

[Guest]

In regards to the annoying hiccup I just spent 3 hours in a bad area Running in LOW conductivity (conductivity switch installed) and it was only letting the hiccup beep or chirp through, flicked into ALL it can become an issue but if you knew there was gold there you could put up with the hiccup or use the SPP in a way that didn't make the hiccup worse.

 

[Roscoe]

I am going to wait to see what Whites has to say about the issue and hope they think it is an issue? If Whites can sort this little issue out then this little detector will be a ripper of a detector for the money. I would have to agree with Oldhand in that people shouldn't be modding these things to try and prevent the hiccup issue. Having said that though i didn't pay a lot of money for it and if i do have a warranty issue i will worry about it then.

Nice little job there Zuke on the conductivity switch. I like the guard mate.

 

[Guest]

Thanks Roscoe it's cut from a piece of Aluminum C section.
In regards to the hiccup I do feel that flicking into Low does fix a lot of the issue and stops a lot of hot ground signals, I don't think whites will have much to say about the issue but I'd be interested to try a purpose build DD coil just for the SPP.

 

[Roscoe]

I am waiting on the 10 turn pot. i think this is going to make a real difference. The current GB pot. is 10k over 270 degrees that's 37 ohm per degree the 10 turn pot. 3600 degrees that's is 2.7 ohm per degree. I am hoping that the SPP will settle out some where in that range and give the processor a break and hopefully remove the hiccup.

That's a good idea using the c section, cut, shape and paint looks solid.

 

[old hand]

A SPP IS BEING RETURNED TO WHITES USA FROM AUSTRALIA [ FOR THE HICCUP PROBLEM]

THE VIDEOS PLUS LINKS TO OTHER VIDEOS HAVE BEEN SENT TO WHITES
we just need to wait for a answer regards john

 

[KarlS]

Yesterday I tried Regis suggestions and taped small strip 5x30mm of lead on Commander 10x5 DD coil. Tried different spots on the coil without any improvement . Then I tried much bigger and thicker piece (2020mm) in winding overlap area . And the coil GB at 7. Mono coil GB at 7.5 in same spot. Well I may be able to use my DD coils after all.
Karl

 

[Roscoe]

I fitted the new GB Pot. today and tested it out, it did not fix the hiccup. It did make ground balancing easier. The EMI today was super high, its windy, hot and slightly over cast and i could not try balancing at higher gain levels to test more.

 

[Roscoe]

KarlS, Did you test the DD coil on some small gold or targets?

 

[KarlS]

Only on 1 cent coin, about 5" down. It pick it OK. I just stopped in the park where i could not GB for about 10 minutes. I also do wonder how the lead taped to the coil will affect depth. Air tests at home, 0.16 gram 9 carat gold about 1.5 cm, but 0.15 gold bit - no response.
Karl

 

[Roscoe]

Karl. I get a good repeatable signal at 3" with commander 8" mono on a 0.15 gram nugget. So that DD coil is lacking quiet a bit of sensitivity compared to mono coil. Fine for coins, but i wouldn't go gold detecting with it. Its a shame really as i would of liked to run a DD myself.

Whats happened to Reg.