The great bank off

[Ryan1981]

My understanding of the Walbanker design is that a non-gold portion of material is necessary to create a collection matrix in the mesh section; both for the walkway and gems and the standard expanded for gold only ...

I haven't tried a wallbanker as yet, my main concern with that type of setup is you really need a second person to rake and clear material from the forward classifier.and the amount of cons at shutdown.
BUT having said that ive been thinking about building one anyway to test anyway LOL, as using the gold hog mats for a year or so now in different layouts , and im not real happy with them at all.

all set ups have there pros and cons,ie.

GOLDHOG mats
My last test, I set at the correct angle in most places that i go on MY setup, at tuena 2 weeks ago i was loosing lots of gold straight out sluice, ive tried and tried with these mats but im done with them,

They are good because of the small amount of cons after the day,ie quick clean ups, but not at the risk of losing 10% plus gold.
They are way over priced in my opinion,maybe some further testing with some expanded or something may help.

I think im going to go back to Vmat on the bottom of the sluice blue bunnings mat, then raised expanded and be done with it.
This system will produce 1/3 bucket of cons for a days digging, But in my setup it has never let me down. It never really mattered about angle/water flow it just worked.
The only reason i stopped using that setup was the amount of cons 1/4 plus of black sand/iron stone was a real bitch to clean.

Rifle ov

But having said that im going to keep on trying different sfuff, mostly because i like to tinker with things OR maybe I must like getting the ***** LOL (A LOT) LOL

Cheers Rhino

 

[Ryan1981]

That's going to be a big test mate, are you going to do different angles on each set up ie 5-20 degrees ?
Also feed rates for material, and different ore from black sand concentrate to light and heavy ironstone wash? and water flow rates for each test?

some of my different things i use or have used in my HBs
Riffles
V-mats
goldhog mats
miners moss
bunnings mats
bunnings BLUE moss
1/2 expanded 2mm 4mm ect ect
Bread crates
carpets ect

Man that's a lot of testing, I want to see that for sure. Im getting excited just thinking about all the different possibility's, Its going to be hours of fun.
Cheers
Ryan

i know its mind numbing thinking about what and how to test

the idea im thinking is to make it as simple as possible

the type of set ups would be the most commonly used, wall banker, Californian sluice, river sluice, and everything in between, so yeah i really want to know the best comb of all u have listed

im thinking instead of worrying about so many different types of material gravels sand combos etc etc etc

just put substituted gold and gem material by itself through a clean sluice that way you would think whatever set up it is, will be working at its most upper limit of catching.

that way if it drops the substituted material out of that particular section type on its first pass,

it would defiantly not catch it with sand or gravel through the matrix,

it would also be easier to see how the heavies react to that section of the rig on camera

Yeah that sounds like a great plan, be great to see the outcome of these test. ONE RING TO RULE THEM ALL kind ****,LOL

 

[WalnLiz]

My understanding of the Walbanker design is that a non-gold portion of material is necessary to create a collection matrix in the mesh section; both for the walkway and gems and the standard expanded for gold only ...

Your understanding is 100% correct Marked. The section under the expanded relys on "displacement" of ironstone and magnetite and as such works best without any restrictions caused by matting, or any sort of restrictive component under it. Under these conditions nothing will "displace" the gold. That's why I stress to put nothing under the expanded and use this section as a boiler box only. It will guaranteed catch 95% of the gold under this section alone.

The gold works its way under these heavies and needs to slide along the slick plate and underneath the heavies, which remain in better suspension with "superior displacement" capability when uninterrupted by matting. Matting of any sort and even Gold Hog displacement rubber interferes with the vortex created by expanded, when it is used in conjunction with it. If you want to use matting under the expanded double the length of the expanded to achieve the same result.....IE...Gold Rush Alaska style.

Gold Hog matting works best when it is used on its own, without introducing foreign vortexes of any sort. Do the experiments and you will soon see for yourself. The boys at Gold Hog spent a fair bit of time working out the vortex pattern for this particular type of matting, and as it is a purely "displacement formula" they used in developing it, experimenting with putting any sort of riffle system on top of it will only result in you getting disappointed with your experimenting.

Best of luck with your high banker versions and hope your systems work very well for you.

Cheers Wal.

 

[WalnLiz]

My understanding of the Walbanker design is that a non-gold portion of material is necessary to create a collection matrix in the mesh section; both for the walkway and gems and the standard expanded for gold only ...

I haven't tried a wallbanker as yet, my main concern with that type of setup is you really need a second person to rake and clear material from the forward classifier.and the amount of cons at shutdown.
BUT having said that ive been thinking about building one anyway to test anyway LOL, as using the gold hog mats for a year or so now in different layouts , and im not real happy with them at all.

all set ups have there pros and cons,ie.

GOLDHOG mats
My last test, I set at the correct angle in most places that i go on MY setup, at tuena 2 weeks ago i was loosing lots of gold straight out sluice, ive tried and tried with these mats but im done with them,

They are good because of the small amount of cons after the day,ie quick clean ups, but not at the risk of losing 10% plus gold.
They are way over priced in my opinion,maybe some further testing with some expanded or something may help.

I think im going to go back to Vmat on the bottom of the sluice blue bunnings mat, then raised expanded and be done with it.
This system will produce 1/3 bucket of cons for a days digging, But in my setup it has never let me down. It never really mattered about angle/water flow it just worked.
The only reason i stopped using that setup was the amount of cons 1/4 plus of black sand/iron stone was a real bitch to clean.

Rifle ov

But having said that im going to keep on trying different sfuff, mostly because i like to tinker with things OR maybe I must like getting the ***** LOL (A LOT) LOL

Cheers Rhino

Just like to bring a couple of things to your attention Rhino. You do not require a second person to do the raking. I run my bankers 90% of the time on my own....unless I'm chasing Sapphires, as that's where Liz comes in. She sorts the large spinels and large sapphires off the classifier so I can shovel volume quicker.

When on your own you simply shovel into the back of the banker, let the spray bar pulverize the clays for a second or two and then scrape the gravel from the front of the spray bar with your shovel. This is as fast as using a Grizzly set up, and gives you a chance to see any large nuggets on the forward classifier. It also "Guarantees" your clay is completely broken down before pushing it off the spray bars.

Secondly the amount of "cons" is less than the Gold Hogg Matting if you run a Crate/ woven matting section of 40cm like I do on my "Gold Only" set up. You can't compare the Boiler box section of heavies as these are only there to facilitate the displacement of the material and as a "Primary Trap" for the gold. They are sieved off quickly with a 1/4" sieve.

You wash the contents of the banker and the mat into a bucket....sieve off the the contents of the bucket through a 1/8" sieve....check the 1/8" sieve for small nuggets.....remaining concentrates in the gold pan will be less than a 1m length of Gold Hog matting used in the same location.

Hope the gold is kind to you this summer Rhino,

Cheers Wal.

 

[Guest]

I can confirm that the Walbanker is quite an efficient one man/woman operation. I nearly always prospect alone.

I bang 3 or 4 shovel loads into the hopper, then rake, examine tailings, then repeat. Worked well in Inverell where I was picking up jelly bean and Smokey quartz crystals off the cable tray before they were discarded

2 people may increase throughput by maybe 10%. The only real advantage of 2 person operation is you only have to do half the shovelling by swapping tasks.

I eventually got hold of some sloped expanded mesh which I have fitted but not yet tested, but am sure it will catch even more gold than the catwalk section I have been using.

Looking forward to the overall results from the tests.

Regards

RS

 

[WalnLiz]

The sloped expanded will work more efficiently on the gold RS, and requires no shaking of the banker to settle the heavies.

Good luck for the season mate and hope the gold clogs the box.

Cheers Wal.

 

[Ryan1981]

My understanding of the Walbanker design is that a non-gold portion of material is necessary to create a collection matrix in the mesh section; both for the walkway and gems and the standard expanded for gold only ...

I haven't tried a wallbanker as yet, my main concern with that type of setup is you really need a second person to rake and clear material from the forward classifier.and the amount of cons at shutdown.
BUT having said that ive been thinking about building one anyway to test anyway LOL, as using the gold hog mats for a year or so now in different layouts , and im not real happy with them at all.

all set ups have there pros and cons,ie.

GOLDHOG mats
My last test, I set at the correct angle in most places that i go on MY setup, at tuena 2 weeks ago i was loosing lots of gold straight out sluice, ive tried and tried with these mats but im done with them,

They are good because of the small amount of cons after the day,ie quick clean ups, but not at the risk of losing 10% plus gold.
They are way over priced in my opinion,maybe some further testing with some expanded or something may help.

I think im going to go back to Vmat on the bottom of the sluice blue bunnings mat, then raised expanded and be done with it.
This system will produce 1/3 bucket of cons for a days digging, But in my setup it has never let me down. It never really mattered about angle/water flow it just worked.
The only reason i stopped using that setup was the amount of cons 1/4 plus of black sand/iron stone was a real bitch to clean.

Rifle ov

But having said that im going to keep on trying different sfuff, mostly because i like to tinker with things OR maybe I must like getting the ***** LOL (A LOT) LOL

Cheers Rhino

Just like to bring a couple of things to your attention Rhino. You do not require a second person to do the raking. I run my bankers 90% of the time on my own....unless I'm chasing Sapphires, as that's where Liz comes in. She sorts the large spinels and large sapphires off the classifier so I can shovel volume quicker.

When on your own you simply shovel into the back of the banker, let the spray bar pulverize the clays for a second or two and then scrape the gravel from the front of the spray bar with your shovel. This is as fast as using a Grizzly set up, and gives you a chance to see any large nuggets on the forward classifier. It also "Guarantees" your clay is completely broken down before pushing it off the spray bars.

Secondly the amount of "cons" is less than the Gold Hogg Matting if you run a Crate/ woven matting section of 40cm like I do on my "Gold Only" set up. You can't compare the Boiler box section of heavies as these are only there to facilitate the displacement of the material and as a "Primary Trap" for the gold. They are sieved off quickly with a 1/4" sieve.

You wash the contents of the banker and the mat into a bucket....sieve off the the contents of the bucket through a 1/8" sieve....check the 1/8" sieve for small nuggets.....remaining concentrates in the gold pan will be less than a 1m length of Gold Hog matting used in the same location.

Hope the gold is kind to you this summer Rhino,

Cheers Wal.

Yeah im starting to see your point Wal, if id only started with your design i might have saved a heap of trial and error, I think that one of the greatest advantages of your setup is the clay breakup from the forward classifier, as my setup i have now does a good job, but i think yours is fare better .

The gold hog mat has preformed Ok, but i run an ezy sluice off the front of my banker as a safety type deal,and funny shaped gold always works itself out of the my mats, and i find them in the ezy sluice.
hmm i feel a Walbanker build happening very soon,lol.
Cheers
Ryan

 

[BIGJON]

We are making the walbanker 2 of almost got all the parts just need the alloy mesh and pump than put it all togeather should be fun

 

[G0lddigg@]

it will be interesting to see the test and results, i have to say you cant test gold capture rates without real gold in its natural environment but a test with perspex and some heavies will be great to watch.

I could write all day about highbanker testing but there are so many different issues here to deal with. What i will say is what works for one bloke may not work for another.
First you must understand the principles behind the design
when you understand that you need to know how and when to adjust pitch , water volume, feed rates and one of the biggest issues... sediment rates.

You can have the perfect setup that's worked in every situation then you find yourself in a high sediment situation and you blow al your gold out all day. Also you can have the best piece of equipment in the world and if you don't understand the principals of why and how it works you will never dial it in. This being said i've used the most comlex to the most basic of material to catch gold and I firmly believe that if you spend the time to understand how gold acts in your own setup to can modify and tweak to suit and even the most basic of machines will capture gold. As we are not mining and this is a hobby most will be happy with 70% + capture rates.

The walkbanker has a dedicated section which helps deal with sediment/ separation called a slick plate incorporating enough length of this into your build will help separation and pull most of the gold down before it even gets to your riffles. Additionally the speed the slurry gathers on the way down keeps the sediment moving through the box.

In the same situation a fluid bed style crash pad will function the same but with a different principle i do this by using a small section of thick m3 miners moss with 1.5inch expanded on top and a reverse riffle to hold material back.
Whats the point? two different ways of dealing with the same issue.... both using fluid dynamics to control the target mineral before we've even got to riffles or moss or rubber or crate....

Basically it is impossible to compare one highbanker to another in a real world test... the only way is to put two blokes side by side with their own highbankers in a perfect mix with exactly the same material and dig as much as the highbanker will allow.

if your going to test sluice runs you will need varied flow, feed and angle for each setup this is one time consuming monster youve got yourself into mate

 

[Goldtarget]

Could not agree more. Perhaps a show us your setup thread would shed more light on this. The more I learn the more I realize there's more than one way to skin a cat. I've seen some pretty awesome pieces of kit created by members based upon sound principles. Equally I've seen some great info about fails.

 

[Guest]

it will be interesting to see the test and results, i have to say you cant test gold capture rates without real gold in its natural environment but a test with perspex and some heavies will be great to watch.

I could write all day about highbanker testing but there are so many different issues here to deal with. What i will say is what works for one bloke may not work for another.
First you must understand the principles behind the design
when you understand that you need to know how and when to adjust pitch , water volume, feed rates and one of the biggest issues... sediment rates.

You can have the perfect setup that's worked in every situation then you find yourself in a high sediment situation and you blow al your gold out all day. Also you can have the best piece of equipment in the world and if you don't understand the principals of why and how it works you will never dial it in. This being said i've used the most comlex to the most basic of material to catch gold and I firmly believe that if you spend the time to understand how gold acts in your own setup to can modify and tweak to suit and even the most basic of machines will capture gold. As we are not mining and this is a hobby most will be happy with 70% + capture rates.

The walkbanker has a dedicated section which helps deal with sediment/ separation called a slick plate incorporating enough length of this into your build will help separation and pull most of the gold down before it even gets to your riffles. Additionally the speed the slurry gathers on the way down keeps the sediment moving through the box.
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/147/1368000297_img_0002_800x566.jpg
In the same situation a fluid bed style crash pad will function the same but with a different principle i do this by using a small section of thick m3 miners moss with 1.5inch expanded on top and a reverse riffle to hold material back.
Whats the point? two different ways of dealing with the same issue.... both using fluid dynamics to control the target mineral before we've even got to riffles or moss or rubber or crate....
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/357/1420842795_crash_pad.jpg

Basically it is impossible to compare one highbanker to another in a real world test... the only way is to put two blokes side by side with their own highbankers in a perfect mix with exactly the same material and dig as much as the highbanker will allow.

if your going to test sluice runs you will need varied flow, feed and angle for each setup this is one time consuming monster youve got yourself into mate

yeah i know time i don't want to give up lol

i have compared two sluices side by side on the same material, but no one liked the results hence this thread

its not ideal how i want to test but its a level playing field it can be documented easily and most of all we can see all that goes on in the box

flow rates and angles will be the published optimum setting for that sluice (less stuffing around) , im sending material to another chap at the end of the week his rig is a varied combination of all so i would love to see how it goes, and i will test mine this week just waiting on deliveries of substituted material

if it works out great if it doesn't then we are all back to speculation and no hard facts

 

[WalnLiz]

If you're going to use a Walbanker for any testing purposes, use the configuration shown below on my general purpose set-up. This is the "GOLD" only version which still gets about 80% of the Sapphires. This version is what I use in extremely heavy ironstone regions.

The version shown above is an old "Gemstone" version, which will still trap all the gold but is better for trapping Sapphires with a rocking motion about every 10 shovels. It's designed to trap high specific gravity stones like Spinel and Sapphires.

Cheers,
Wal

 

[Ryan1981]

This is my current setup it does do a good job, the ezy sluice is used to catch the weird shaped gold that the hog mats miss.

 

[Mudguts]

Hey wal
What is the degrees of fall you use on your gold n gems set ups
Yo stop blockages

 

[Tathradj]

Heck,
If you really want to improve your catch rate, Just stick another 1.5 Meters of box on a Banker. Design your own riffles to your hearts content.
At the end of the day, Just learn what is going on without having to freak about the small percentage of what is "Going out the other end". If you are blowing more than that which is except able, you are doing something wrong.
.
If you come up with a setup that will catch 100% either gold or gem's with all the variables thrown in, And only measure within 2 meter's long that you can cart a few hundred meter's up a creek, You would be a happy chappy indeed over night but I guess that it would end up being called a Long Tom any way.
.
If you really want to watch what happens in a Banker, Just set it up and toss clean white sand into it.
And if you want to go further, Toss a hand full of heavy clean mineral into it as well with the sand. Heading warnings, Lead bird shot with some of it hammered flat is good.
.
Damn it, I am giving to much away but that is within the spirit of things. PMSL

 

[Ryan1981]

Heck,
If you really want to improve your catch rate, Just stick another 1.5 Meters of box on a Banker. Design your own riffles to your hearts content.
At the end of the day, Just learn what is going on without having to freak about the small percentage of what is "Going out the other end". If you are blowing more than that which is except able, you are doing something wrong.
.
If you come up with a setup that will catch 100% either gold or gem's with all the variables thrown in, And only measure within 2 meter's long that you can cart a few hundred meter's up a creek, You would be a happy chappy indeed over night but I guess that it would end up being called a Long Tom any way.
.
If you really want to watch what happens in a Banker, Just set it up and toss clean white sand into it.
And if you want to go further, Toss a hand full of heavy clean mineral into it as well with the sand. Heading warnings, Lead bird shot with some of it hammered flat is good.
.
Damn it, I am giving to much away but that is within the spirit of things. PMSL

LOL another 1.5 meter sluice, ITS heavy enough,

The goldhog guy has said many times that his mat traps 95% of gold going through, Im not convinced, im yet to try the lead trick on this setup.
have you any other ideas to improve my current setup?
Cheers Ryan

 

[Ryan1981]

Heck,
If you really want to improve your catch rate, Just stick another 1.5 Meters of box on a Banker. Design your own riffles to your hearts content.
At the end of the day, Just learn what is going on without having to freak about the small percentage of what is "Going out the other end". If you are blowing more than that which is except able, you are doing something wrong.
.
If you come up with a setup that will catch 100% either gold or gem's with all the variables thrown in, And only measure within 2 meter's long that you can cart a few hundred meter's up a creek, You would be a happy chappy indeed over night but I guess that it would end up being called a Long Tom any way.
.
If you really want to watch what happens in a Banker, Just set it up and toss clean white sand into it.
And if you want to go further, Toss a hand full of heavy clean mineral into it as well with the sand. Heading warnings, Lead bird shot with some of it hammered flat is good.
.
Damn it, I am giving to much away but that is within the spirit of things. PMSL

LOL another 1.5 meter sluice, ITS heavy enough,

The goldhog guy has said many times that his mat traps 95% of gold going through, Im not convinced, im yet to try the lead trick on this setup.
have you any other ideas to improve my current setup?
Cheers Ryan

 

[G0lddigg@]

Hey ryan i wasn't going to say anything but since you asked i would suggest you mix up your matts a bit. All of your matt is drop riffle you need some upwards action. Throw a scrubber or riverhog in mate. Ur basically slows flow down untill it packs up GH works best by creating slow then fast then slow etc. Just my two bob. Spend over $3000 testing matts...

 

[Tathradj]

I have designed a set of riffles that do work very, very well that I drop in place of my "Bread Crate"in my Banker.
I will not give away on how I designed them on here as a bit of thought went into it based on the obvious above that I stated.
.
Heck, It is not rocket science to work it all out.
Having two types of setup gives me the scope on what I do based upon a simple design that any one can build.

.
I base my designs on just going out and having fun but also putting into a little bit of brain and eye power to achieve the best possible result I can in a small compact unit with out having to take a mortgage out to get there or loose any sleep over it.
.
Every one has their own setup that they are happy about but I myself would rather spend my down time coming up with clearer objectives, than to build a 007 banker that wins over all hands down.
.
If you really, really wanted to go all out, Multiply a Walbankers measurements by 2.5 then drive it all with a 3 Inch pump.
Defeats the purpose to me.
Somehow. :lol:

 

[Tathradj]

Or you could simply add a turbine driven tromell to really speed things up but how far do you really want to go.