Dja Dja Wurrung Plan released excluding prospectors

[Teemore]

Where did you send it? And can we copy and paste a few details to send also?

Sent to their email address ....... [email protected]

Feel free to copy or reword it however you see fit.

Can PM you a copy of my VEAC submission if it helps.

Cheers Tom.

 

[ProspectorPete]

Great work there Tom.

I've also recently donated to BUGU as well as purchasing 10 BUGU stickers for family and friends to put on vehicles to hopefully start raising awareness to the issue.
Some here suggest that becoming a Politician is the only way to fix the issue but I think in reality by the time that process would happen it would be too late, voicing our thoughts and being visual at rallies and voting at this Novembers State Election for the party that will have our (all bush users) best interests in mind is the only quick fix to the problem.

I don't understand the suggestion that the land be returned to the first owners and about us prospectors digging in their back yard, I thought they belonged to the land as opposed to owning the land, well that's what I've been hearing for the past 40+ years.
Every doco or show on Aussie outback I've seen (many) say " us Aboriginal people don't own the land, we belong to it" which is vastly different to owning it but that is a whole other argument for another day.

I was also of the understanding a few weeks back when reading on the BUGU site that the Greens were using the 'traditional owners' as a way to gain weight in their argument for locking the bush up, but the traditional owners came out and said they were opposed to locking up the bush as it wasn't in their best interest.

It's all very confusing who to believe as there's stories circulating from every direction, I just hope common sense prevails but unfortunately it isn't that common.

Makka, I've regularly frequented most the areas they are wanting to lock up including the Bendigo area at the start of this thread.

Lets hope for the sake of us prospectors and all users of the bush that our current public land remains just that........PUBLIC
Otherwise I'll have to get the wife to prove she has indigenous blood lines (she has) to the Government so we can claim some good land in prime location and I'll hold regular PA parties for yous all layful:

 

[dam it]

Viva La Revolution :bomb: :bomb:
Grab Ya Torches and Pitchforks :lol: :lol:

 

[isolation]

I'll start with this one...

Might look at joining PMAV too even though I'm in NSW

 

[Jaros]

Letter sent.

 

[PabloP]

I still have to ask the question, how many of the forum members have been there in the last ten years?
Mackka

Well I have been north of the Jardine, in the impacted Victorian goldfields and also WA and some NSW goldfields, but that does mean a thing, as the removal of what have been basic rights is just plain and simply wrong.

Rob P

 

[Mackka]

I understand what everyone is saying now, thanks Tom.
Mackka

 

[Bjay]

Call me defeatist but if theyve already spent the dollars on this( love to know how many millions) I really dont see any amount of submissions really making any difference. To me there minds made up. Only chance of this being repealed in my eyes is a change of government. Still then not a given. All depends on removing the do gooder feel good about themselves mungbean eating save the world types of edumacted Daisys putting there own agendas in other peoples heads. I for one have always kept out of areas Im not supposed to be in. If this goes ahead Ill go where I feel the call and accept the consequences if required.

Its my bush(forest) too,and all yours as well. ower:

 

[Bjay]

I think its time we had a eureka flag emoticon.

 

[thedigger]

There is about 12000 Miners right holders,and about 800 PMAV members,that tells me that there is a lot that are not pulling their weight.
The PMAV needs funds to fight,but if every one paid up,the job would be easier.

 

[dinger]

Roll up,roll up meeting at Bakery Hill, fly that Southern cross flag again !

 

[Teemore]

Roll up,roll up meeting at Bakery Hill, fly that Southern cross flag again !

Read that and remembered how low attendance there was when a "protest" rally was organised for the steps of Parliament House in Melbourne, only 100 or so attended, with slightly fewer when similar rallies were held in a few rural towns.

However, I think this has merit and will put it to the Bush Users United Group (BUGU) for consideration.

Eureka anniversary date comes up on 5th December, after the election but still before the VEAC submissions close.

Thanks.

 

[Mr Magoo]

This is your problem. Determined 5 years ago.

Local government area(s) Ballarat City, Buloke Shire, Campaspe Shire, Central Goldfields Shire, Greater Bendigo City, Hepburn Shire, Loddon Shire, Macedon Ranges Shire, Moorabool Shire, Mount Alexander Shire, Northern Grampians Shire, Pyrenees Shire

Protest may not be the best option. Pages 9/10 make interesting reading.

https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/doc/member-docs/3008/1539784143_bendigo.pdf

 

[MegsyB007]

This is what stumps me...

"[Name deleted to protect the privacy of an individual] also states that on a regular basis he visits and
maintains sites of significance to the Dja Dja Wurrung because he has been taught that the land owns me and
that I, as a member of the Dja Dja Wurrung community, have traditional rights in that country. He states that
he makes artefacts such as didgeridoos, boomerangs, clap sticks and spears and gathers stones, plants and
animals from the bush in Dja Dja Wurrung country sometimes for the purpose of trading with other
Aboriginal communities. He practices traditional skills such as making a traditional shield or building
[Sensitive information deleted at the request of the applicants] and passes on these traditional skills to
children.

So he didn't say he owns the land at all. He said it owns him. So did the land give him those traditional rights??? How does that work?
And he admitted that he's hacking at trees, pulling apart plants and gathering stones and animals - all things that the environmentalists say should be stopped in these areas - and why they're trying to shut us out! And he admits that he's going to teach kids to do these things too.

How can this be right?!

 

[pagan prospector]

This is what stumps me...

"[Name deleted to protect the privacy of an individual] also states that on a regular basis he visits and
maintains sites of significance to the Dja Dja Wurrung because he has been taught that the land owns me and
that I, as a member of the Dja Dja Wurrung community, have traditional rights in that country. He states that
he makes artefacts such as didgeridoos, boomerangs, clap sticks and spears and gathers stones, plants and
animals from the bush in Dja Dja Wurrung country sometimes for the purpose of trading with other
Aboriginal communities. He practices traditional skills such as making a traditional shield or building
[Sensitive information deleted at the request of the applicants] and passes on these traditional skills to
children.

So he didn't say he owns the land at all. He said it owns him. So did the land give him those traditional rights??? How does that work?
And he admitted that he's hacking at trees, pulling apart plants and gathering stones and animals - all things that the environmentalists say should be stopped in these areas - and why they're trying to shut us out! And he admits that he's going to teach kids to do these things too.

How can this be right?!

hi Megsy if you take a look at the previous post you will see the reason all you have to do is say what is in the report and it is right i feel there will be far far greater fallout from this than anyone realizes beginning to feel sorry for the people who choose to love this area and make it their home i for one was not born in this country but every where i go throughout this beautiful country i feel a true connection sorry (not) for the rant
Pagan P

 

[user 7222]

Call me defeatist but if theyve already spent the dollars on this( love to know how many millions) I really dont see any amount of submissions really making any difference. To me there minds made up. Only chance of this being repealed in my eyes is a change of government. Still then not a given. All depends on removing the do gooder feel good about themselves mungbean eating save the world types of edumacted Daisys putting there own agendas in other peoples heads. I for one have always kept out of areas Im not supposed to be in. If this goes ahead Ill go where I feel the call and accept the consequences if required.

Its my bush(forest) too,and all yours as well. ower:

You are correct, my friend. THIS round of closures/new Parks WILL go through. This is a fight to stop MORE land from being closed on the NEXT round....and there WILL be a next round. They snuck this lot through pretty far before anyone got wind of it. Can't repeal a National Park but we'll fight for no new ones.

 

[Mr Magoo]

Call me defeatist but if theyve already spent the dollars on this( love to know how many millions) I really dont see any amount of submissions really making any difference. To me there minds made up. Only chance of this being repealed in my eyes is a change of government. Still then not a given. All depends on removing the do gooder feel good about themselves mungbean eating save the world types of edumacted Daisys putting there own agendas in other peoples heads. I for one have always kept out of areas Im not supposed to be in. If this goes ahead Ill go where I feel the call and accept the consequences if required.

Its my bush(forest) too,and all yours as well. ower:

You are correct, my friend. THIS round of closures/new Parks WILL go through. This is a fight to stop MORE land from being closed on the NEXT round....and there WILL be a next round. They snuck this lot through pretty far before anyone got wind of it. Can't repeal a National Park but we'll fight for no new ones.

They have had exclusive possession for five years.

1. Exclusive Possession

The rights and interests possessed by the native title claim group under the traditional laws acknowledged and
traditional customs observed by them confer on them possession, occupation, use and enjoyment of the land and
waters to the exclusion of all others.

I just don't understand what was "snuck" through.

 

[Teemore]

I just don't understand what was "snuck" through.

"Snuck" through may not be the correct terminology, it's more a case of yes having that (for want of a better word) "power" all previous communications with the PMAV indicated that there was NO PROBLEM with prospectors/prospecting. Does a change in a previous commitment without advising the other party of the change mean it was "snuck" through??? Call it what you will the reneged on a prior commitment.

The very broad overview map (in original post) does not clearly identify the proposed exclusion areas, in fact nothing they released to date provide specific areas, I've asked for that information but to date the response has been zero/nada/silence/nothing (see letter below).

From your comments are we to assume that you're in favour of this push by VEAC and DDW to ban prospecting from these extensive areas, I have NO problem with reference zones being established to conduct valid independent assessments, I am however strongly opposed to blanket bans based on a whim.

Cheers T.

 

[Mr Magoo]

From your comments are we to assume that you're in favour of this push by VEAC and DDW to ban prospecting from these extensive areas, I have NO problem with reference zones being established to conduct valid independent assessments,

I don't think any of my comments suggest that at all.

What I am pointing out is the problem being faced is not to do with what is proposed now but what was accepted five years ago. The bottom line is by law they have the exclusive rights and you/we/everybody else is excluded. I live with that line everyday of the week and I'm sure a few other members of this forum also do. All it takes is one complaint to the TO board and all access allowances are instantly removed. No if's or buts or protests.
Now if we want access again we have to work with the TO's. Negotiate and discuss. Personally I don't think waving a piece of paper around saying "We paid you how much to ............." is going to have that much positive affect. If someone waved it in my face when hoping to get access to my land I would have great pleasure in really slamming the door shut. You can't get past the fact it's their land, the same as your land is yours. Can I come and detect in your back yard? Probably not. But that's just my opinion. Sometimes things need a more delicate approach. Work smarter.
By the way I haven't gone into huge depth about maps etc. I just had a look at who had native title and roughly what area it covered.

Also I'm not against trying to get access allowed at all. I'm just saying. It's a minefield where native title exists and things can get worse. Quickly. :Y:

 

[Teemore]

Thanks MM,
I don't think we're disagreeing but using your analogy had you given me access to your backyard and then years later pointed a shotgun in my face for accessing the land you previously allowed me on, then yes you would be within your rights BUT your motives, credibility and future promises would be seriously questioned.

My approach is to politely ask what areas will be affected, it may in fact a non issue BUT without that information it remains an issue.

I am not aware of groups other than the DDW who have been granted 'ownership', perhaps you have that information.

If other groups have similar 'rights' then we all face serious future access issues.

Cheers T.