slowflow
Barry
Bugger the greenies & dumb law makers, making uninformed decisions.
QLD Fossicking Laws!!!
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TenOunce Tone
tony
Ok after speaking to Michael at the Mareeba office of the Mines Dept today, I can confirm the following:
Use of a sluice is prohibited under the Queensland Fossicking Act 1994.
You can use hand tools and these are described in Part one of the act, Preliminaries.
-----------------------------------------------------
Fossicking Act 1994
Part 1 Preliminary Page 9
hand tool means
(a) a pick, shovel, hammer, sieve, shaker, or electronic detector; or
(b) a tool declared by regulation to be a hand tool.
------------------------------------------
I did ask about a rocker box that is operated by hand and was told it would be ok. I will be taking the one I build for an inspection when complete to get the ok
If you have a device you want to use, I would suggest you get in contact with your local office and have them rule on its applicability, it may be decleared to be a hand tool!
You can use sluices, highbankers, if you are on a lease.
Cheers, Tone
Use of a sluice is prohibited under the Queensland Fossicking Act 1994.
You can use hand tools and these are described in Part one of the act, Preliminaries.
-----------------------------------------------------
Fossicking Act 1994
Part 1 Preliminary Page 9
hand tool means
(a) a pick, shovel, hammer, sieve, shaker, or electronic detector; or
(b) a tool declared by regulation to be a hand tool.
------------------------------------------
I did ask about a rocker box that is operated by hand and was told it would be ok. I will be taking the one I build for an inspection when complete to get the ok
If you have a device you want to use, I would suggest you get in contact with your local office and have them rule on its applicability, it may be decleared to be a hand tool!
You can use sluices, highbankers, if you are on a lease.
Cheers, Tone
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It all comes down to the interpretation of the pencil neck your talking to and their interpretation of the rules.
There are lot's of full time fossickers/prospectors who have had no issue re use of highbanker and have got the ok from the mines dept hence it is a very grey area and honestly better to noe poke and prod them too much otherwise they will be inclined to make this into black and white and ban all forms of sluices. (In reality a highbanker is just another version of a sluice)
I'm a mod on the Qld Prospectors site as is another member here and there are quite a few members actively involved in the forums here and as far as I know of nobody I know of has ever been told that using their highbanker or sluice is illegal.
At the end of the day it will always come down to the interpretation of the rules by an inspector,ranger etc and this grey issue isn't just Qld as it's just as muddy in other states.
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth and I wont stop highbanking until someone in authority tells me and proves to me that it's banned as all digging is done by hand and sluice or highbanker is processing the material.
There are lot's of full time fossickers/prospectors who have had no issue re use of highbanker and have got the ok from the mines dept hence it is a very grey area and honestly better to noe poke and prod them too much otherwise they will be inclined to make this into black and white and ban all forms of sluices. (In reality a highbanker is just another version of a sluice)
I'm a mod on the Qld Prospectors site as is another member here and there are quite a few members actively involved in the forums here and as far as I know of nobody I know of has ever been told that using their highbanker or sluice is illegal.
At the end of the day it will always come down to the interpretation of the rules by an inspector,ranger etc and this grey issue isn't just Qld as it's just as muddy in other states.
Anyway that's my 2 cents worth and I wont stop highbanking until someone in authority tells me and proves to me that it's banned as all digging is done by hand and sluice or highbanker is processing the material.
elrodeo said:
Hey Elrodeo
Thanks for your input here, I know a few of the guys On QLD Prospectors have been doing a huge amount of work to get better access & good on you guy's for that.
I am annoyed with the restriction on us in this state However I am happy to take the lead from you guy's who have been doing the "Lobbying" if you think it could be counter productive to push this issue, can you please initiate some discussion with the guys at the front of the fight, Waz & Secret Squirrel (I have chatted to him a bit) in regards to if you think I should back off with this????? would be interested to here some feed back, I will be joining your site.
cheers
Lee
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Lee mate flick Waz (Ando aka Admin) a pm as he is pretty much on the pulse of things.
He may be a bit slow on reply due to his study commitments but he should be able to help or put you in the right people to get in touch with.
It's a real hard situation as yes you want to stand up for your rights (and I'm right behind this) and lobby for a bit of sanity and make the rules clear cut and have sluices , highbankers fully approved.
Let's just hope things stay grey or at the very least, improve for all fossickers/prospectors.
Mate there is absolutely nothing wrong in standing up for what you believe in and after spending a long ,long time living o/seas i was shocked to come back to Oz and see how complacent most Aussies had become. Government brings in new legislation , everybody has a whinge for a bit and then all forgotten. It used to be people "Up in Arms " and marching on the streets for our democratic rights at the very least.
He may be a bit slow on reply due to his study commitments but he should be able to help or put you in the right people to get in touch with.
It's a real hard situation as yes you want to stand up for your rights (and I'm right behind this) and lobby for a bit of sanity and make the rules clear cut and have sluices , highbankers fully approved.
Let's just hope things stay grey or at the very least, improve for all fossickers/prospectors.
Mate there is absolutely nothing wrong in standing up for what you believe in and after spending a long ,long time living o/seas i was shocked to come back to Oz and see how complacent most Aussies had become. Government brings in new legislation , everybody has a whinge for a bit and then all forgotten. It used to be people "Up in Arms " and marching on the streets for our democratic rights at the very least.
Goal posts have been shifted again!
It looks like the Fossicking Act in Qld has been amended on 28th March, 2014. Not sure what the changes are yet.
Here's the amended Act:
https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/F/FossickingA94.pdf
Here's the regulations that support the Act (they are dated 1st July 2013 so don't appear to have changed)
https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/F/FossickingR09.pdf
It looks like the Fossicking Act in Qld has been amended on 28th March, 2014. Not sure what the changes are yet.
Here's the amended Act:
https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/F/FossickingA94.pdf
Here's the regulations that support the Act (they are dated 1st July 2013 so don't appear to have changed)
https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/F/FossickingR09.pdf
Just read the amended Fossicking Act the changes are significant and include provision for the payment of royalties to the state you need to read Chapter 11 of the mining act in conjunction with the fossicking act:
https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/M/MineralReA89.pdf
https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/M/MineralReA89.pdf
prospecting tourism is going down big time....i just got back from Sapphire CQ doing some sapphire fossicking and usually this time of year the parks and free camping start to get loaded....there was 3 campers....sapphire businesses are slowly starting to falter its pathetic because of these stupid restrictions and especially now that sapphires are getting harder to find and dig for....15 years ago it was packed because it was easy now people arent bothering because its too difficult and restrictions are everywhere...its the same with gold.. pathetic something needs to be done and im more than happy to help support it!
What it comes down to is simply this if it is written in current legislation then it is law.
There have been a couple of comments made here that loosely interpreted are saying bugger the law, Ill do what I please and it is precisely this type of attitude along with illegal activity that make it hard for the majority.
Being a full-time sapphire miner I have had quite a lot of dealings with the Qld Mines Dept in its various formats and I would be the first to say that compared with other states we are very much over regulated. There have been numerous changes to legislation over the years that I havent agreed with, but regardless of whether I agree or not, I still have to comply with the law it has been non-compliance issues by too many that have resulted in a tightening of the regulations.
If the Department of Natural Resources & Mines decided to do a sweep through the Central Qld gemfields with a big stick approach to enforcing the legislation then most claim holders would lose their claims for non-compliance issues and quite a lot of fossickers would also be in breach of the regulations. As it is, the Mines inspectors are reasonably lenient in their approach to both claim holders & fossickers and with the latter, the main issues are not having the relevant permits.
The free camping area here in Sapphire has been reduced in size and enforcement of the council bylaw of only 48 hour camping in any 2 week period is being regularly policed. The reason for this is due to the attitude of those who believe they have the right to do what they please and stay as long they like.
We are a fairly layback community here as most fossicking and small time mining areas are in not just Qld, but also in other states we keep it that way by not rattling the cage of government law makers too much.
For those who believe that they have a legitimate cause or reason for doing any activity outside of the framework of the law then please put your argument to the relevant authority rather than stuffing it up for the rest of us by taking the Ill do as I please approach.
Jeff
There have been a couple of comments made here that loosely interpreted are saying bugger the law, Ill do what I please and it is precisely this type of attitude along with illegal activity that make it hard for the majority.
Being a full-time sapphire miner I have had quite a lot of dealings with the Qld Mines Dept in its various formats and I would be the first to say that compared with other states we are very much over regulated. There have been numerous changes to legislation over the years that I havent agreed with, but regardless of whether I agree or not, I still have to comply with the law it has been non-compliance issues by too many that have resulted in a tightening of the regulations.
If the Department of Natural Resources & Mines decided to do a sweep through the Central Qld gemfields with a big stick approach to enforcing the legislation then most claim holders would lose their claims for non-compliance issues and quite a lot of fossickers would also be in breach of the regulations. As it is, the Mines inspectors are reasonably lenient in their approach to both claim holders & fossickers and with the latter, the main issues are not having the relevant permits.
The free camping area here in Sapphire has been reduced in size and enforcement of the council bylaw of only 48 hour camping in any 2 week period is being regularly policed. The reason for this is due to the attitude of those who believe they have the right to do what they please and stay as long they like.
We are a fairly layback community here as most fossicking and small time mining areas are in not just Qld, but also in other states we keep it that way by not rattling the cage of government law makers too much.
For those who believe that they have a legitimate cause or reason for doing any activity outside of the framework of the law then please put your argument to the relevant authority rather than stuffing it up for the rest of us by taking the Ill do as I please approach.
Jeff
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It is a shame when areas are closed down or the authorities come down heavy because of too many people doing the wrong thing - ie overstaying at free sites by long periods of time, leaving gates open, leaving mountains of rubbish lying around, having a bath in stock water troughs with soap etc. That said, I might have it wrong but in this particular case it seems to me that the legislation is wrongly classifying a piece of hand equipment as though it were something else. If it's what I'm thinking of then it cannot possibly be anything other than a hand tool - it has no motor and no moving parts of any kind. Looks like it's a pretty run-of-the-mill piece of hand-powered prospecting equipment in other states and many goldbugs here are probably quite rightly angry to discover it's use is illegal, seemingly for no reason. And of course, the problem with taking your complaints to the relevent authorities is that the chances of you being listened to are less than zero - they have spent large sums of money paying law firms to draft up these regulations, they are not going to reveiw them for a number of average Joe complaintants too small to be of any political consequence.
I would agree that most claimholders of the CQ gemfield are probably breaching legislation to some degree - but if they policed it to the letter, there would soon be no-one and nothing left to police. The field and the communities on it would cease to exist. There seems to be quite a hefty slew of regulations attached to it and I don't intend to breach any of them regardless of how hard or impractical they might make what should be such a simple and straightforward activity, but it is worthwhile remembering that said regulations have generally been drafted by people who know sweet FA about digging for sapphires in the CQ bush and care even less. They live in a paper world, the impact that their rule making has for the people who actually carry out the activity is pretty immaterial to them.
I would agree that most claimholders of the CQ gemfield are probably breaching legislation to some degree - but if they policed it to the letter, there would soon be no-one and nothing left to police. The field and the communities on it would cease to exist. There seems to be quite a hefty slew of regulations attached to it and I don't intend to breach any of them regardless of how hard or impractical they might make what should be such a simple and straightforward activity, but it is worthwhile remembering that said regulations have generally been drafted by people who know sweet FA about digging for sapphires in the CQ bush and care even less. They live in a paper world, the impact that their rule making has for the people who actually carry out the activity is pretty immaterial to them.
So did anyone notice the new requirement to pay Royalties to the State on your finds in the ammended Fossicking act?
TenOunce Tone
tony
I did see something that if you had a significant amount of return from the gold /precious /gems.. I dont think they are interested in the one or two ounces here and there.
No one from the Palmer area has mentioned paying royalties to me..
Cheers, Tone
No one from the Palmer area has mentioned paying royalties to me..
Cheers, Tone
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gcause said:
I think they were already there gcause - I seem to recall reading them in the small miners handbook before I applied. But I think you have to make a pretty significant-sized find before you have to pay royalties, as Tone says they aren't interested in an ounce or two of gold or a few stones.
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Whoops, I see you were referring to the fossicking act. I suppose when you grant yourself the sort of pay rises we have seen recently, you might need to come up with some extra financing - but of course, they're worth every cent aren't they? 
The payment of royalties only applies to claim/lease holders and not to fossicking. The legislation is a bit ambiguous in the interpretation.
Division 3, Section 35 states:
Payment of royalties to State
(1) This Act does not affect a requirement under another Act to
lodge royalty returns for, and pay royalties on, fossicking
materials collected by a licensee.
(2) However, despite the Mineral Resources Act 1989, a licensee
need not file a royalty return under the Act for minerals
collected by the licensee in a royalty period if no royalty is
payable under the Act for the minerals for the period.
(3) In this section
licensee means
(a) the holder of an individual or family fossickers licence;
or
(b) an individual fossicking under another kind of
fossickers licence.
That section is pure government legalese mumbo jumbo because it doesnt state one way or another if royalties are applicable to fossicking.
The following section (36) states:
Sale or use of fossicking material in trade or commerce
(1) This section applies to fossicking material collected under a
licence.
(2) A licensee must not
(a) in trade or commerce, sell the material; or
(b) use the material in the production of something else for
sale in trade or commerce.
Maximum penalty400 penalty units.
(3) However, this section does not apply to
(a) an occasional sale or use of fossicking material; or
(b) a sale or use prescribed by regulation.
Royalties are only payable if you sell the mined mineral and the sale exceeds a prescribed amount in dollar value in a 12 month period. The prescribed amount varies from mineral to mineral. Royalties applicable to sapphires kick in at $100,000 and the scheduled fee is 2.5% of sale value. The royalty free threshold used to be $30,000 for sapphires and other precious gemstones and even at that amount I doubt that many small miners would have made sales above that amount in any given royalty period and doubt that they would have declared the sale if they had.
More info on royalties is available here: https://www.osr.qld.gov.au/royalties/rates.shtml
Jeff
Division 3, Section 35 states:
Payment of royalties to State
(1) This Act does not affect a requirement under another Act to
lodge royalty returns for, and pay royalties on, fossicking
materials collected by a licensee.
(2) However, despite the Mineral Resources Act 1989, a licensee
need not file a royalty return under the Act for minerals
collected by the licensee in a royalty period if no royalty is
payable under the Act for the minerals for the period.
(3) In this section
licensee means
(a) the holder of an individual or family fossickers licence;
or
(b) an individual fossicking under another kind of
fossickers licence.
That section is pure government legalese mumbo jumbo because it doesnt state one way or another if royalties are applicable to fossicking.
The following section (36) states:
Sale or use of fossicking material in trade or commerce
(1) This section applies to fossicking material collected under a
licence.
(2) A licensee must not
(a) in trade or commerce, sell the material; or
(b) use the material in the production of something else for
sale in trade or commerce.
Maximum penalty400 penalty units.
(3) However, this section does not apply to
(a) an occasional sale or use of fossicking material; or
(b) a sale or use prescribed by regulation.
Royalties are only payable if you sell the mined mineral and the sale exceeds a prescribed amount in dollar value in a 12 month period. The prescribed amount varies from mineral to mineral. Royalties applicable to sapphires kick in at $100,000 and the scheduled fee is 2.5% of sale value. The royalty free threshold used to be $30,000 for sapphires and other precious gemstones and even at that amount I doubt that many small miners would have made sales above that amount in any given royalty period and doubt that they would have declared the sale if they had.
More info on royalties is available here: https://www.osr.qld.gov.au/royalties/rates.shtml
Jeff
Brother
Rob Tingay
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I had all these problems when I started, was happy to pan as The Law said! But where? How far and how much. QLD a big place.
So I asked people around,? land owners, a few claim and lease owners, I was a few months after and all my permits paid! (1 more thing to keep us down!) before I got a chance of going to get a little bit of gold!!
Land owners where the best, easer to approach and ask. You may know many already!! And so I just started trying creeks on land that I had Permission to be on! And whalla I have 2 good spots (1st vid)
And 1 great spot (last vid).
I have permission to be there, and for what Im doing! Make sure you have it too!! Especially if your doing a youtube vid, as it will be evidence against you!
Now I still stick to the rules of fossicking!! fill my holes and even more!
To be totally honest! ITS A COMPLETE LOAD OF
Don't break the law, take your time, talk to people, (Hi there, may I have permission to fossick in the creek down the back) you may be surprised,
You may also be surprised on how much Gold you pass by to get to the Gold fields?
Very best with this, good luck.
So I asked people around,? land owners, a few claim and lease owners, I was a few months after and all my permits paid! (1 more thing to keep us down!) before I got a chance of going to get a little bit of gold!!
Land owners where the best, easer to approach and ask. You may know many already!! And so I just started trying creeks on land that I had Permission to be on! And whalla I have 2 good spots (1st vid)
And 1 great spot (last vid).
I have permission to be there, and for what Im doing! Make sure you have it too!! Especially if your doing a youtube vid, as it will be evidence against you!
Now I still stick to the rules of fossicking!! fill my holes and even more!
To be totally honest! ITS A COMPLETE LOAD OF
Don't break the law, take your time, talk to people, (Hi there, may I have permission to fossick in the creek down the back) you may be surprised,
You may also be surprised on how much Gold you pass by to get to the Gold fields?
Very best with this, good luck.
Solomon 009
Paul
TenOunce Tone said:
So I went to the site and this is what it said.......................Paul
Page not found
Sorry, the page you are looking for could not be found. We are regularly making improvements to our website, so it might not exist any longer or the web address you used may be wrong.
Try using our site search to find the topic you are looking for or return to our home page.
We also welcome your feedback on ways we can improve our site.
Last updated 16 January 2014
Solomon 009
Paul
Our new areas are open!
3 areas in Durikai and one in Talgai.
I was told its open- but not to do a press release to the papers ect until the minister decides if he will do a release.
I will have detailed maps soon of the areas for Oziexplorer.
Thanks to everybody who helped get them open,It was a hard slog, but we did it.
I will be drafting a letter naming and thanking those who I dealt with in government, and sending it to the ministers involved.
Durikai Area
Talgai Area
Source: http://queenslandprospectingclub.or...eensland-s-new-declared-fossicking-areas#6487
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