QED users - how are you faring?

[Guest]

These are the important bits from the QED manual
MENU CONTROLS :: THRESHOLD B - BIAS
2: THRESHOLD B
( Setting range is 1-99 with default setting at 50 )
Note: BIAS can change slightly overtime depending on temperature.
When the detector is Ground Balanced the audio volume will be very low.
Lowering the BIAS will accentuate rising pitch targets (generally a small target ) When prospecting for fine gold fit a small coil and adjust the BIAS accordingly to suit the coil using a known specimen target.
Raising the BIAS will accentuate falling pitch targets (usually large targets ) When prospecting for larger specimens fit your selected coil and adjust the BIAS to suit your selected coil.
NAVIGATING TO BIAS
PRESS the button on option menu number 2, to open the BIAS setting
BIAS NEUTRAL POSITION
Locating the Neutral Position which is determined by raising and lowering the BIAS and taking note of the numbers.
Start by raising BIAS with the button until it the BIAS starts to get to a certain volume level e.g. 58. Then lower the BIAS with the button until you get the same volume level e.g. 44. The example range is 58
less 44 = 14. Halve the 14, which becomes 7. Add 7 to 44 = 51.

MENU CONTROLS :: THRESHOLD A - VOLUME
3:THRESHOLD A
( Setting range is 1-90 )
The VOLUME control in conjunction with the BIAS controls the detectors audio signal. Best results can be achieved by using a selected coil and MODE to suit either large or small targets, setting VOLUME low and using an appropriate BIAS to set the audio
Threshold or setting BIAS to neutral and use VOLUME to create desired threshold.

 

[user 4485]

Ive only used mine 5 times so far, the 1st two times was getting to grips with the settings, coils etc. Working too much and crap weather are mainly to blame. I got 4 bits of gold incl one over a gram. I dont have a big range of coils to test with and I find it produces too much noise between coil changes and I have to fiddle with all the settings to get it right again. Often it takes me 10 minutes to quieten it down. On the plus side, it can be amazingly sensitive and finds small thin targets that the SDC cannot hear at all. Set correctly with a big coil, it can punch amazingly deep too! Super light weight especially when the battery pack is removed from the detector and I use a cable. Whats the cost of the AGB, control upgrades etc??

To get the AGB upgrade was $110 but I left the control box the same i.e. attached to the handle not the newer version of it under the arm cuff & seperate display on the handle. Stinky Pete Detech or Dean at Goldsearch could tell you the full upgrade price. Firmware updates were/are free apart from postage. :Y:
Interesting that you've found gold with the QED that a SDC cannot hear at all. Not doubting you but I'm not seeing that as yet. I've used my QED about 6 times for around 30-40 hours. Surprises me at times but totally frustrating at others.

 

[user 4485]

These are the important bits from the QED manual

Read numerous times & following as best I can understand.
So when bias is set to neutral just how high is it recommended to go with volume (threshold A). Like said I was up as far as 81 but told this was too high & a contributing factor in the noise I was getting.
Now using lower volume (30-40) & using bias to set threshold which does seem better re: unwanted noise but then some signals dont seem as sharp either?

 

[Guest]

These are the important bits from the QED manual

Read numerous times & following as best I can understand.
So when bias is set to neutral just how high is it recommended to go with volume (threshold A). Like said I was up as far as 81 but told this was too high & a contributing factor in the noise I was getting.
Now using lower volume (30-40) & using bias to set threshold which does seem better re: unwanted noise but then some signals dont seem as sharp either?

That's about the vol level with the bias at null when people are using Sennheiser RS160 Wireless Headphones which so far has proved to be the best wireless system on the QED.
These are not cheap at about $300 but those using them find them very good with no emi pickup and very little latency and they also have their own vol control. This is the system that Jrbeatty on my forum uses for his QED.

Some other tips
The QED does not play well with one piece 3.5mm to 6.3mm adapters, The weight of the 6.5mm plugged into the adapter creates noise, the cheaper ones being worse than the expensive ones, but none of them seem immune to creating noise.
If your using one.
Get rid of the one piece 3.5mm to 6.3mm adapter, and replace it with a 3.5mm to 6.3mm lead of suitable length, with the 6.3mm end cable tied some where on the detector shaft.
Get these
30cm 11in 6.35mm 1/4" Female To 3.5mm 1/8" Male Stereo Audio Adapter Cable MP3
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/30cm-11i...736167?hash=item1a140fe6e7:g:BWgAAOSwQSZXPpzA

Increasing the audio output of the QED
There is an internal adjustment pot that can be used to change the output level. Adjusting it requires the removal of the front 4 screws and sliding the PCB an inch forwards. The adjustment pot is just beside the audio output socket. A small flat screwdriver is required. Clockwise rotation increases the output level. Headphones are capable of letting the operator hear the slightest change in the audio and therefore enhance the ability to hear a target at the threshold of detection.

The QED audio was designed to be fed into an external amplifier/speaker eg NOKIA MD11.
Headphones without some sort of booster amp will not allow the rise in volume from a target to be heard very well.The volume level required to drive headphones adequately will overload an external amp.

From another QED user in the NT ( from the private QEd users group on my forum)
I had the threshold A set at 50 as I felt this was best suited to my coil being medium size.
if I went lower it started to get a tad noisy .. didnt think of going higher as was after medium to small size targets in the dolerite.
3. Theshold B
Set this to 60 as just hearing the threshold change and happy with this setting.
4. Gain
My gain set at 2 .. going to 3 sometimes increased noise a little.
5. Mode - Sample Delay
I tried all settings for this one and found that 10 was the best figure...
Either side of this value and started to get a tad noisy .. 10 was quiet for the
coil I was using. I could still pick up my .2 gram gold target on surface .. Remember this is horrendous ground to work.
hope this helps,
cheers

 

[Goldchaser1]

Gave it a few goes over here mbasko,just aint happening,been offered the updates so might send it over but i get the feeling that'll be just dumbing it down,they have a platform but thats about it for hot ground i think,needs alot more development.
Mode 7-8 on laterite and you can allmost use it,i say allmost,only ran a 15x12 or 10 detect mono on it which is a very quiet stable coil,i can run my 45 with that coil in normal way better then the qed on laterites,performance is not real good with modes up around 7-8 i noticed.
Another problem when on the hot ground i noticed is falsing,i was a confussed why actually cause i know that coil is a ripper,had me buggered one day until i grabbed the control box,touch it or a light squeeze and bingo-noise,so just the swinging and combo of hot ground i think upsets it.
Now its more or less sitting next to the exercise bike in the spare bedroom,they make a great pair.
The size of it is impressive but they have a long way to go before its a versatile unit compared to the competition i think.....

The noise that you are experiencing when you squeeze the control box sounds like a faulty board perhaps a dry joint.Needs to be returned for fixing under warranty. The 3.5 mm audio jack can also be noisy if you use an adapter.In the updates the audio now has 2 audio sockets or you can specify which one you want.
You should also check to see that the earth field adjustment is spot on because if its not then any swinging of the coil thorough the geomagnetic field will induce a signal. Swinging and combo of hot ground will not upset the QED!
The updates in the mode expand the range of the sample delay.The consequence of this is that as the sample delay is increased the sensitivity and depth to targets with faster decay times ie short time constants (tiny nuggets/specimens)may diminish or disappear altogether.However for targets with longer time constants ie larger more solid nuggets the depth and sensitivity losses will be smaller due to the GB method that the QED uses which is actually MPS but in a single channel.This is opposite to what happens in a ML gpx with smooth modes where as the time constant of nuggets increases the depth and sensitivity falls off dramatically compared to normal timings. As the audio of the QED is not boosted one key to using it is to listed for pitch changes(which the ear is most sensitive too) rather the changes in vol because if the signal is below the trigger point level for the audio circuit then you will only hear a change of pitch. This is where the bias setting becomes important.
What bias where you using and what GB readings were you getting on the laterites?
I will respond to the other post when i get time as i am very busy at the moment.
hope this helps

Its been a while,i tried it on 3 seperate occassions,more or less gave up after that,bias was adjusted to the middle range and best ground balance numbers were floating around 140,give or take,early on it was touted as being able to handle any ground etc so sounded promising,some of the posts here (after mode updates) just confirm my thoughts that it wont do the job on our ground,even you guys inbetween all the technical jargon and big words have changed your tune a bit in reguards to hotter ground,was it tested in WA?
It may be faulty but ive seen hints of the same type of behaviour on laterite when we tried an atx,reminded me of that a little,atx coil especially became touch sensative,hard to describe but the ground seems to wind the machine up somehow,i'll send it back over but id rather sell it to be honest,id prob let it go for under $1k,few times i tried it the wife kits up walks off with the gpz,im standing there trying to get the thing to balance on this ground for ten minutes then the next half hr is not a whole lot better,you cant find gold standing still fiddling with buttons.....

 

[Guest]

Gave it a few goes over here mbasko,just aint happening,been offered the updates so might send it over but i get the feeling that'll be just dumbing it down,they have a platform but thats about it for hot ground i think,needs alot more development.
Mode 7-8 on laterite and you can allmost use it,i say allmost,only ran a 15x12 or 10 detect mono on it which is a very quiet stable coil,i can run my 45 with that coil in normal way better then the qed on laterites,performance is not real good with modes up around 7-8 i noticed.
Another problem when on the hot ground i noticed is falsing,i was a confussed why actually cause i know that coil is a ripper,had me buggered one day until i grabbed the control box,touch it or a light squeeze and bingo-noise,so just the swinging and combo of hot ground i think upsets it.
Now its more or less sitting next to the exercise bike in the spare bedroom,they make a great pair.
The size of it is impressive but they have a long way to go before its a versatile unit compared to the competition i think.....

The noise that you are experiencing when you squeeze the control box sounds like a faulty board perhaps a dry joint.Needs to be returned for fixing under warranty. The 3.5 mm audio jack can also be noisy if you use an adapter.In the updates the audio now has 2 audio sockets or you can specify which one you want.
You should also check to see that the earth field adjustment is spot on because if its not then any swinging of the coil thorough the geomagnetic field will induce a signal. Swinging and combo of hot ground will not upset the QED!
The updates in the mode expand the range of the sample delay.The consequence of this is that as the sample delay is increased the sensitivity and depth to targets with faster decay times ie short time constants (tiny nuggets/specimens)may diminish or disappear altogether.However for targets with longer time constants ie larger more solid nuggets the depth and sensitivity losses will be smaller due to the GB method that the QED uses which is actually MPS but in a single channel.This is opposite to what happens in a ML gpx with smooth modes where as the time constant of nuggets increases the depth and sensitivity falls off dramatically compared to normal timings. As the audio of the QED is not boosted one key to using it is to listed for pitch changes(which the ear is most sensitive too) rather the changes in vol because if the signal is below the trigger point level for the audio circuit then you will only hear a change of pitch. This is where the bias setting becomes important.
What bias where you using and what GB readings were you getting on the laterites?
I will respond to the other post when i get time as i am very busy at the moment.
hope this helps

Its been a while,i tried it on 3 seperate occassions,more or less gave up after that,bias was adjusted to the middle range and best ground balance numbers were floating around 140,give or take,early on it was touted as being able to handle any ground etc so sounded promising,some of the posts here (after mode updates) just confirm my thoughts that it wont do the job on our ground,even you guys inbetween all the technical jargon and big words have changed your tune a bit in reguards to hotter ground,was it tested in WA?
It may be faulty but ive seen hints of the same type of behaviour on laterite when we tried an atx,reminded me of that a little,atx coil especially became touch sensative,hard to describe but the ground seems to wind the machine up somehow,i'll send it back over but id rather sell it to be honest,id prob let it go for under $1k,few times i tried it the wife kits up walks off with the gpz,im standing there trying to get the thing to balance on this ground for ten minutes then the next half hr is not a whole lot better,you cant find gold standing still fiddling with buttons.....

If you get noise when the control box is squeezed then your QED has a fault! Return it to be checked out under warranty and get the new firmware and the bias capacitor replaced before you give up. The original QED was not tested in WA but was tested over some similar ground at the Teetulpa GF in SA which is horrendous in places. As i have posted earlier a QED user in the NT can run his updated QED over NT laterites and very nasty dolerites.
You have still not said what mode/vol/gain settings you were using on your QED. The ground cannot wind up the QED and the QED is being used on ground where the GB reading is over 150! There is ground that the QED cannot handle eg very reactive frequency dependent susceptible ground on the margins of salt lakes.

 

[Goldchaser1]

Ok thankyou aegpf,that doesnt surprise me,i was gonna say if it was tested in WA laterites it must of been Ronald McDonald,this is the nugget hunting mecca of australia if not the world,sorry but not testing it here was a major mistake.
We can go around in circles as far as settings go etc until the cows come home,in the end its not suited to heavily mineralised ground,takes about ten minutes to work that out,i'll bow out of this conversation now,thanks for the feedback and goodluck with it

 

[Guest]

Ok thankyou aegpf,that doesnt surprise me,i was gonna say if it was tested in WA laterites it must of been Ronald McDonald,this is the nugget hunting mecca of australia if not the world,sorry but not testing it here was a major mistake.
We can go around in circles as far as settings go etc until the cows come home,in the end its not suited to heavily mineralised ground,takes about ten minutes to work that out,i'll bow out of this conversation now,thanks for the feedback and goodluck with it

How can we reach any valid conclusions about your QED when it appears to be faulty? Are you going to tell this to any potential buyers or are you going to sell it and be able to tell people that it has been fully checked out? You say that the QED is not suitable heavily mineralised ground and yet are unwilling to give it a fair go again after its been updated and checked out. While you are entitled to your opinion your conclusion are not born out by the almost every other QED user and without knowing how you have tried to set up your QED and all the settings you tried to use everyone is in the dark.
I am sorry that you are unwilling to be helped and at least i know i have done my best and I would still be willing to give you BW email or phone number so that he may help you.
cheers,
PS Vic is the nugget mecca of Australia and the world.

 

[Tathradj]

Ok,
Settle down please..

 

[Eski]

Not that it matters, but mine handles hot clay domes without issue, these domes fine gold gets wobbles on. the zed is similar, the only thing gettign clese to smooth is a proper modded F1a4 on channel 1 only...

but , what do i know about laterite...

Really though, plenty of people have issues with minelab/other machines... they simply send them back. Minelab/other services and returns with the issue sorted.
seems simple enough.

Why not do the same with the QED?

 

[user 4485]

Why would it not matter? That's the whole point of the thread to see how others are going.
I'm not sure what you know about laterite but fill us in.
It would be great to see your set up/ground balance process, other settings & what coil you're using to be able to run smoothly in these areas.
Mine has not long come back from having some upgrades so if it turns out that it has a fault then I will have the tomtits!

 

[Rush]

Thanks mbasko for starting this thread discussion for those of us who have a QED.
I am a bit reluctant to return my QED for the updates that may dumb down it down along with the AGB.
Although the new front panel with large buttons across the bottom would make setting adjustment much easier.

Roscoe posts some very interesting points especially since only having a QED for a couple of weeks.
Therefore I assume his QED has the new front panel with larger buttons and all of the latest updates including the AGB?
And I look forward to him posting his preferred setup procedure?

 

[Krisco]

Ive only used mine 5 times so far, the 1st two times was getting to grips with the settings, coils etc. Working too much and crap weather are mainly to blame. I got 4 bits of gold incl one over a gram. I dont have a big range of coils to test with and I find it produces too much noise between coil changes and I have to fiddle with all the settings to get it right again. Often it takes me 10 minutes to quieten it down. On the plus side, it can be amazingly sensitive and finds small thin targets that the SDC cannot hear at all. Set correctly with a big coil, it can punch amazingly deep too! Super light weight especially when the battery pack is removed from the detector and I use a cable. Whats the cost of the AGB, control upgrades etc??

To get the AGB upgrade was $110 but I left the control box the same i.e. attached to the handle not the newer version of it under the arm cuff & seperate display on the handle. Stinky Pete Detech or Dean at Goldsearch could tell you the full upgrade price. Firmware updates were/are free apart from postage. :Y:
Interesting that you've found gold with the QED that a SDC cannot hear at all. Not doubting you but I'm not seeing that as yet. I've used my QED about 6 times for around 30-40 hours. Surprises me at times but totally frustrating at others.

Cool, thanks Mbasko! I havent seen any upgrade price quoted anywhere, even on the QED website! I feel I need some serious hours behind the coil to get the hang of it fully. Lots of settings and adjustment ideas mentioned here to work on I havent found any gold that the SDC cant hear yet but plenty of thin wire and flakes of rusty tin that any SDC cant hear whatsoever. I reckon if these were thin, specie type gold Id be the only one able to hear them. Yes the frustration level is high with me too....just when I think Ive got it sorted, next time out I prove myself wrong haha

 

[Krisco]

Amongst all the discussion re laterite, Ive used my QED on hot patches of thick ironstone gravel where the GB numbers were up to 148-9. Bit warbly but signals still popped through.

 

[Eski]

Will Do tomorrow Mbasco, it is the basic Goldsearch setup with a special bracket, 4 pin plug, 15 inch Evo and a duct taped wireless battery. I cannot remember the settings as i have not been out in a while. - hope to be out on the 22nd so if i remember i'll update then.

And my machine has not been in for the update.
the most annoying issue thus far is the bias drift but i've nutted it out. - this will be sorted after i send it off.

What i meant was that i know nothing about Laterite being in vic and a deposit never been pointed out to me. It would be great to have one pointed out to me, that way i can test before WA trip a whole year away....

 

[user 4485]

Made some progress today! Couldn't fault the QED all day. Ran smooth as with only a few easily dismissed ground noises.
When I first started up it was sounding like last time & I was thinking here we go again. I pulled up & slowly went back through everything again. Main changes from the other day was leaving bias neutral & upping the volume from 40 to 50 (as per comment posted by AEGPF) + the ground today seemed a bit milder to previous spots.
Still not 100% on the AGB as even though it got close I felt it still needed manual fine tuning & for the most part manually adjusted during the day.
Settings were:
GB - between 111 to 117
Bias (threshold B) - 51
Volume (threshold A) - 50
Gain - 1
Mode - 3
Coil - Detech 11" Ultra Sensing Mono
Headphones - Sennheiser RS160 wireless
Found a 2 grammer & 5 grammer both around 8-10" deep.
Will need to get back to a few areas over the next couple of weeks but hopefully I'm starting to get on top of it now.

 

[Krisco]

Laterite is normally associated with high rainfall/tropical regions, either prehistorical or current. Vic has never had the conditions to create it. Its in a lot of locations in SA, NT, QLD and of course WA though.

 

[Rush]

Still not 100% on the AGB as even though it got close I felt it still needed manual fine tuning & for the most part manually adjusted during the day.

At times I find it difficult to pick on some ground whether the audio is a rising or a falling sound when manually adjusting the GB.

So the AGB is more of an aid on which way to adjust to fine tune the GB if the GB numbers on the screen are either rising or falling as the coil is lowered towards the ground.

Have been to use to just pressing the GB button on my GPX.

 

[Guest]

Made some progress today! Couldn't fault the QED all day. Ran smooth as with only a few easily dismissed ground noises.
When I first started up it was sounding like last time & I was thinking here we go again. I pulled up & slowly went back through everything again. Main changes from the other day was leaving bias neutral & upping the volume from 40 to 50 (as per comment posted by AEGPF) + the ground today seemed a bit milder to previous spots.
Still not 100% on the AGB as even though it got close I felt it still needed manual fine tuning & for the most part manually adjusted during the day.
Settings were:
GB - between 111 to 117
Bias (threshold B) - 51
Volume (threshold A) - 50
Gain - 1
Mode - 3
Coil - Detech 11" Ultra Sensing Mono
Headphones - Sennheiser RS160 wireless
Found a 2 grammer & 5 grammer both around 8-10" deep.
Will need to get back to a few areas over the next couple of weeks but hopefully I'm starting to get on top of it now.

Good to hear that you are getting on top of the QED. Keep it up you will now find more gold i am sure!

 

[Guest]

Made some progress today! Couldn't fault the QED all day. Ran smooth as with only a few easily dismissed ground noises.
When I first started up it was sounding like last time & I was thinking here we go again. I pulled up & slowly went back through everything again. Main changes from the other day was leaving bias neutral & upping the volume from 40 to 50 (as per comment posted by AEGPF) + the ground today seemed a bit milder to previous spots.
Still not 100% on the AGB as even though it got close I felt it still needed manual fine tuning & for the most part manually adjusted during the day.
Settings were:
GB - between 111 to 117
Bias (threshold B) - 51
Volume (threshold A) - 50
Gain - 1
Mode - 3
Coil - Detech 11" Ultra Sensing Mono
Headphones - Sennheiser RS160 wireless
Found a 2 grammer & 5 grammer both around 8-10" deep.
Will need to get back to a few areas over the next couple of weeks but hopefully I'm starting to get on top of it now.

From being frustrated to getting to work the QED and finding gold, what do you say was the difference in achieving your good day with the QED?