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Jonathan Porter said:
Bit concerned with the High Volume setting Big Nugget, headphones or WM12 speaker? If WM12 then that's probably ok. Also what Audio Smoothing setting were you using?

jp

Hey JP,

was using the WM12, AUDIO SMOOTHING = HIGH.

ground was very hot however it didn't seem to lose sensitivity on high but was very unstable on low.

What alternative settings would you think I could use on this ground JP?

Thanks for your advice mate.

cheers ;)
 
Big Nugget said:
Jonathan Porter said:
Bit concerned with the High Volume setting Big Nugget, headphones or WM12 speaker? If WM12 then that's probably ok. Also what Audio Smoothing setting were you using?

jp

Hey JP,

was using the WM12, AUDIO SMOOTHING = HIGH.

ground was very hot however it didn't seem to lose sensitivity on high but was very unstable on low.

What alternative settings would you think I could use on this ground JP?

Thanks for your advice mate.

cheers ;)

When next out detecting please perform a re-set all settings via the Quick Start screen (top left icon, then right selection option) then after the auto tune has been performed keep holding the coil away from the ground and not touching the Quick Trak button, change the Tone to the way you like, put the Audio Smoothing into OFF position, lift the Volume control on the detect screen from 8 to 10 or max of 12 for WM12 speaker use, once done please perform the following....

"Work Flow:

.........select an area typical of your chosen location without trash targets, then with coil held at detection height above ground hold the Quick Trak button in and walk steadily away swinging the coil evenly (with Quick Trak still held in), after 10 to 12 seconds (listen to the audio during this time and you will hear the unit stabilize) you can release the Quick Trak button.

This method is extremely simple to do and should add near zero time to your normal routine, exposing the coil evenly to as much typical ground as possible in that time frame helps immensely with the GB averaging. Do not pump the coil after initial switch on or straight after a re-set, after the above process has been followed then you can pump the coil if its needed during the session. "

Factory default is High Yield/Difficult, Sensitivity 9, Threshold 27, Tracking Auto, Audio Smoothing Low, Tone 53,

I use the following in combination with a booster speaker, Volume might need to be lifted slightly if the WM12 speaker is used and lower for headphones.

High Yield/Difficult for mineralised 12" or less deep ground were smaller nuggets are present
General/Difficult for mineralised 12" and deeper ground were there's a greater chance of larger nuggets
Sensitivity 10 to 12
Audio Smoothing Off
Tone 60
Tracking Auto
Volume 10

If the initial GB procedure is not accurate the detector can sound unstable and noisy, High Yield/Difficult is a lot more sensitive than other modes so there will be some ground types that will be twitchy even after the initial GB procedure requiring the use of General or even Severe. If you lift the Volume too much it can make the detector sound extremely noisy and twitchy, there is a massive difference between 10 and 12 for instance. I'm seeing a common trend with users who have way too much Volume and then having to back off the sensitivity which is the wrong way round.

Audio Smoothing OFF is a lot louder volume wise than Low or High, using High Audio Smoothing can force the use of higher Volume levels, however the use of Audio Smoothing cuts back on a lot of detector performance. Its better to run a lower Audio Smoothing (OFF) and then balance the Volume and Threshold controls for a more comfortable experience, but this all needs to be done after the initial set up GB process has been followed correctly.

Hope this helps,

JP
 
thanks for that JP.

great info mate.

I will pay more attention to the EMI/GB procedure from now on as i have probably been a bit sloppy in that area.

Thanks for pointing that out, I think you hit the nail on the head.

Will give those settings a run and see how it goes.

cheers ;)
 
Jonathan Porter said:
When next out detecting please perform a re-set all settings via the Quick Start screen (top left icon, then right selection option) then after the auto tune has been performed keep holding the coil away from the ground and not touching the Quick Trak button, change the Tone to the way you like, put the Audio Smoothing into OFF position, lift the Volume control on the detect screen from 8 to 10 or max of 12 for WM12 speaker use, once done please perform the following....

"Work Flow:

.........select an area typical of your chosen location without trash targets, then with coil held at detection height above ground hold the Quick Trak button in and walk steadily away swinging the coil evenly (with Quick Trak still held in), after 10 to 12 seconds (listen to the audio during this time and you will hear the unit stabilize) you can release the Quick Trak button.

This method is extremely simple to do and should add near zero time to your normal routine, exposing the coil evenly to as much typical ground as possible in that time frame helps immensely with the GB averaging. Do not pump the coil after initial switch on or straight after a re-set, after the above process has been followed then you can pump the coil if its needed during the session. "

Factory default is High Yield/Difficult, Sensitivity 9, Threshold 27, Tracking Auto, Audio Smoothing Low, Tone 53,

I use the following in combination with a booster speaker, Volume might need to be lifted slightly if the WM12 speaker is used and lower for headphones.

High Yield/Difficult for mineralised 12" or less deep ground were smaller nuggets are present
General/Difficult for mineralised 12" and deeper ground were there's a greater chance of larger nuggets
Sensitivity 10 to 12
Audio Smoothing Off
Tone 60
Tracking Auto
Volume 10

If the initial GB procedure is not accurate the detector can sound unstable and noisy, High Yield/Difficult is a lot more sensitive than other modes so there will be some ground types that will be twitchy even after the initial GB procedure requiring the use of General or even Severe. If you lift the Volume too much it can make the detector sound extremely noisy and twitchy, there is a massive difference between 10 and 12 for instance. I'm seeing a common trend with users who have way too much Volume and then having to back off the sensitivity which is the wrong way round.

Audio Smoothing OFF is a lot louder volume wise than Low or High, using High Audio Smoothing can force the use of higher Volume levels, however the use of Audio Smoothing cuts back on a lot of detector performance. Its better to run a lower Audio Smoothing (OFF) and then balance the Volume and Threshold controls for a more comfortable experience, but this all needs to be done after the initial set up GB process has been followed correctly.

Hope this helps,

JP

Awesome.....many thanks JP!

One favor deserves another;

http://www.aurumaustralis.com/index.html

Regards

;)
 
mbasko said:
There is a post on another forum by a bloke that has a pin in his leg - from knee to ankle. He said he has never had an issue with any other detector/coil combination. The GPZ is picking it up though & has caused him to change his "style".
And people want to do air tests to prove/disprove its sensitivity :lol:

That would be me.

Welcome JP.
 
By Steve Herschbach....the Zed guru!

[video=480,360]https://youtu.be/5wAUIEZPSeo[/video]

Steve Herschbach said:
This is not a technical paper by a technical genius. My smarts tend to be in the practical application of metal detector technology in the field. I am less concerned by the theory at work under the hood than the actual detecting characteristics revealed in actual use. I would very much welcome smarter people than I pointing out any obvious technical inaccuracies below!

It has been clearly stated that the GPZ 7000 is not a pulse induction metal detector. Yet it sounds and acts deceptively like previous Minelab pulse induction models, just enough to get people into trouble. I think it is people who are expert with Minelab pulse induction detectors that are having a harder time adjusting to the GPZ 7000.

My background comes far more from the VLF side of things. VLF is a misnomer, because it means Very Low Frequency, and was originally nothing more than a subset of induction balance or transmit/receive (TR) detectors. From http://www.vlf.it/frequency/bands.html

ULF ultralow frequency 300Hz to 3000Hz
VLF very low frequency 3kHz to 30kHz
LF low frequency 30kHz to 300kHz

Thus it can be seen that the White's GMT at 48 kHz and Fisher Gold Bug 2 at 71 kHz are actually LF (Low Frequency ) detectors, not VLF detectors. And a White's V3i running in 2.5 kHz single frequency mode is running in the ULF range. But these days VLF has become a more generic term referring to induction balance detectors in general.

I used to always think in terms of Induction Balance and Pulse Induction as the two different methods used for inducing currents into the ground by modern metal detectors. But things are getting more complicated. Most single frequency induction balance detectors use phase shift for ground balance and discrimination, whereas Minelab BBS and FBS multi frequency detectors rely on time constants, blurring the line between time domain pulse induction and frequency domain induction balance. Minelab is addressing that by now referring to all non-pulse induction detectors as Continuous Wave or CW detectors. Pulse induction detectors have a transmit period, and a non-transmit (zero transmit) period. From http://www.minelab.c... Technology.pdf

"CW means Continuous Wave and includes all technologies that do not have zero transmit periods (almost all technologies other than PI)."

The GPZ 7000 is most definitely not a pulse induction detector in that the detector is always transmitting into the ground. But where a PI measures the time constant of items from the point where the transmit period ends the GPZ measures from the instant where the transmitted field polarity reverses. Again, like with the BBS and FBS detectors Minelab is mixing continuous wave transmission with time domain processing.

OK, blah, blah, blah in layman's terms and no doubt not entirely accurate from a technical standpoint. But close enough for me to have an epiphany recently while running the GPZ 7000. It acts like a super VLF detector more than a pulse induction detector. The ground responses, hot rock responses, salt responses, and gold responses are not that different than what I might expect from a mid-frequency VLF detector albeit one that is much, much more powerful.

Everything in metal detecting tends to be a trade off or come at a cost. The Minelab SD/GP/GPX series of pulse induction machines were a progression with later models designed to handle salt ground and hot rocks that earlier models could not handle. The problem is when you tune out a salt signal you tune out weak gold signals. When you tune out certain hot rocks, you tune out certain types of gold signals. Savvy operators always knew that by running in older "Normal" modes they would have to deal with more noise and possibly dig more hot rocks but they could also find gold that more aggressive timings missed.

When I run the GPZ 7000 from a purely operational standpoint it acts and feels like a super VLF and basically that is what it is, with a transmission mode that leaves the ground with less ground signal to deal with than that generated by a high power pulse, employing an advanced coil design, and advanced ground balancing algorithms to deal with ground mineralization while still deriving the extra power and sensitivity inherent in continuous wave detectors. I am curious where Bruce Candy's head was when he came up with the ZVT concept, but it appears to me to derive more from the BBS and FBS line of thinking than being something related to the PI machines.

The point of all this? Forget about how your PI acts and works and if anything treat the GPZ more like a Super VLF than a pulse induction detector. Certain old VLF tricks work with the GPZ. The main one being - get that coil off the ground!!

Saturable Soils

Again from http://www.minelab.c... Technology.pdf

"The GPZ 7000 coil must be symmetrical about the leftright axis because ZVT transmitted signals cause a type of signal to be produced from the ground which is absent during PI receiving periods. This ZVT receive signal is from something called soil magnetic hysteresis. If an asymmetrical (unsymmetric) coil like a DoubleD is used by a ZVT detector (asymmetrical because the transmit coil is on one side and the receive coil on the other), a signal is produced which depends on the speed at which the coil is swept over the ground (and how close the coil is to the ground), and the audio tone will be higher going in one direction (for example left to right), and lower when sweeping in the other direction, which would clearly be unacceptable."

The text goes on to say the Super D coil design is employed to avoid this problem. A better word than avoid may have been reduce. The issue has been reduced but not totally avoided. Have you run into it yet? The GPZ producing a rising high tone as you swing one direction, and a descending low tone as you swing the other direction? Another way flattering way of thinking about it is the GPZ moans and groans as you swing. This is the common response over salt or alkali ground. The intensity depends on the amount of salt in the ground but also on the speed at which the coil is swept over the ground and how close the coil is to the ground.

The solution might include changing gold or ground modes of course. But irregardless of that one obvious solution of to simply slow down and keep a very constant swing speed. This will moderate the effect and still allow nugget signals to stand out.

The less obvious solution and one that many people will have a very hard time accepting is - raise the coil. Many VLF detectors will overload on bad ground and the simple answer is to raise the coil to eliminate the overload. This is counter-intuitive to people who always scrub the ground with the coil. How can raising the coil add depth? It can and it will if the electronics are being swamped with excessive receive signal.

Once again from http://www.minelab.c... Technology.pdf

"In any of the above settings, it pays to swing the coil an inch or so above the soil surface if the soils are considered saturable (VRM). Saturable means that a detector ground balances well if the coil is raised and lowered down to about a few centimetres above the soil surface, and for the worst saturation, down to several centimetres, but not if the coil is swung up and down to a height lower than these saturation height thresholds (e.g. down to the soil surface.) In addition, the degree of (VRM) soil saturation is considerably less for Difficult or Severe than Normal. As the metal detector coil is moved towards a soil, the transmitted magnetic field in the soil gets stronger. This causes a (very) small degree of VRM signal saturation that happens to cause the resistive signal relative slope of the tilt to change. This is why the amount of VRM soil saturation is far less for Difficult and Severe than Normal. Soil saturation often requires the user to operate the coil several centimetres above the soil surface for best results.

However, whilst soils do have resistive signal that are very accurately loglinear, unfortunately this is not perfectly accurate for some soils, and, because the GPZ 7000 has such very high sensitivity, even miniscule deviations in the straightness of the line of the loglinear resistive signal will cause ground noise signals. Severe is less sensitive to these miniscule deviations than Difficult. Whilst the GPZ 7000 does not have a dedicated salt detection setting (saline soils), the best Gold Mode setting for salt soils is Extra Deep."

Extra Deep is an extra long time constant mode and so is less sensitive to weak signals from both salt ground and small gold. It is the classic metal detecting trade - you cannot get super sensitive to gold without getting sensitive to salt. Machines can totally eliminate salt effects but never think it does not come at a cost in lost gold. The trick is to get the larger stuff, and the tips above are the same you would employ with any hot VLF in an attempt to deal with saturable ground. The simplest one was the one I wanted to highlight because it just goes so much against the grain.

Raising your coil above the ground can actually add more depth!

None of these solutions is a magic bullet and will totally eliminate the issue on the GPZ 7000. It will succeed to a greater or lesser degree in different locations with different soil conditions.
 
The part that Steve says about raising the coil off the ground with VLF machines and it seems you need to do this with the ZED too, As Steve refers to it as a Super VLF, What this also does is reduce the amount of small junk targets that are close to the surface along with the fact that DD's have a dead Zone up to the first 2 inches from the coil and by raising the coil does away with random signals that can be unrepeatable, By raising the coil it does away with some of the ground noise which makes it easier to hear those fainter deeper targets, (Although the ZEDs Coil is not a DD)

A few people have had issues with wearing the bottom of the ZEDs coil/cover when in fact because the ZED is more like A VLF machine it would make sense to use it like a VLF and then coil damage would be kept to a minimum, Sticking on a Big Coil on a VLF and raising it off the ground is an old Hoard Hunters Trick and the machine will punch deeper, and using this method is also a great help in junk filled sites too,

hope this helps,, John
 
Is there a test you can do to check if your machine is work optimum? mine is very similar to my mates 4500 with an elite coil.
 
From Minelab -
Place the coil on something like a plastic table and away from electrical interference
switch on and reset to factory default , test should be carried out in HY / N
now wave the 5c coin over the coil this will give you the bench mark , you should be able to break the TH at 45cm

I Couldn't find a quiet spot so just tested at a spot near harvest Home.
HY/N holding the Z horizontal and coming from afar,
slight sound at about 24"
dig me sound at about 18 - 20".
Happy with that.
 

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