Makro Gold Kruzer information and questions

[markie_d]

I run mine almost standard factory settings using the 7.5 inch coil. Ive picked up tiny gold at 2 - 3 inches and the best piece .7gram at 6inches. Very honest machine. Gold usually shows up around 44 on the number scale. I dig nothing in very low or very high numbers. Generally 20 ish is steel. Im a convert. Its a cheap addition to my 4500. Cheers

Hi Kemjak,
Thanks for the info, i have been using the GK19 7.5 inch coil also, From what i have read (i could be wrong) a DD coil is apparently better for very small stuff??
What would the larger CC coil be used for? does it give greater depth with less sens? (sorry still learning this stuff)

 

[XLOOX]

The larger GK26C (10.5x5 CC) coil will go deeper than the 7.5x4DD on targets above about 0.35g so yes greater depth with less sensitivity.

I actually mainly run the GK24 (9.5x5 DD) as I find this to be better than the 10.5x5CC in handling ground and seems to be even better in depth on all size targets, which I wasnt expecting, maybe in really mild ground the CC would be deeper on bigger ones, not sure.

I change to the 7.5x4DD when I want to check out quartz outcrops or when I am in a really trashy area as the narrow field makes it great for picking out targets from dense trash. In one area recently there were multiple targets per swing, 99% ID iron but occasionally one would go higher & with perserverance I found 6 .22short shells and a 0.3g speccy.

If you want to learn the machine quickly then go find somewhere in the GF that is trashy. Digging 30 targets in 2 hrs will teach you more than wandering around all day & picking up just a shot pellet & 22 case. Make sure though that you check the ID & target signal both ways, have a 25mm scrape, check again and repeat. Take your time, that target isnt going anywhere !

Think about the sound, bar & numbers and how the are changing and make a call ( def iron, maybe gold, prob lead ) then see what it really is and how far down. Dont just go hoeing in eagerly on first ID else you just wasted your best learning opportunity.

Also if you choose a trashy area you probably have a better chance at finding gold as all the PI guys will have walked away from there, as will those with older non discriminating VLFs.

 

[markie_d]

The larger GK26C (10.5x5 CC) coil will go deeper than the 7.5x4DD on targets above about 0.35g so yes greater depth with less sensitivity.

I actually mainly run the GK24 (9.5x5 DD) as I find this to be better than the 10.5x5CC in handling ground and seems to be even better in depth on all size targets, which I wasnt expecting, maybe in really mild ground the CC would be deeper on bigger ones, not sure.

I change to the 7.5x4DD when I want to check out quartz outcrops or when I am in a really trashy area as the narrow field makes it great for picking out targets from dense trash. In one area recently there were multiple targets per swing, 99% ID iron but occasionally one would go higher & with perserverance I found 6 .22short shells and a 0.3g speccy.

Hmmm...... interesting, tbh, i never considered buying the larger GK24, (being the newby that i am) i took one look at the cut outs in the coil and figured it was for relic hunting (as that is the style of coil i have seen used on the go find and equinox ect).....

I might have to have a look into it... I must admit the small size of the GK19 makes it a little hard to cover large areas. the GK24 might be the way forward.

 

[XLOOX]

Coil cutouts have nothing to do with relic vs gold prospecting, they are just a great way of changing the weight of the coil.

They nearly always make it lighter than a solid coil of same dimensions but the cutout also affect the volume of the coil so if the coil fill is buoyant then cutouts reduce buoyancy. This is of benefit when trying to detect in creeks etc.

The down side of cutouts is the tendency to hangup on sticks and the impossibility of a good tape seal on the coil scuff cover.

You probably associate cutouts with relic hunting because for that you want depth and the targets are not tiny so they often use big coils and with big coils that can weigh over a kg you really want to minimise weight so you often see cutouts in larger coils ( +14")

 

[XLOOX]

Your question about small targets got me thinking. Since using Threshold setting to sharpen up the faint target audio response also affects the background hum when there is no target, I thought I would have a look at just how the optimum Threshold setting varies with Volume Setting.

I set up the 1 grain test piece under 45mm of slate as that is the max I could get a reasonable dig-me audio only response (no ID or Bar) with starting settings as above. Note that depth is already WAY deeper than the 25mm with ID & 1 bar mentioned above showing you that if you only wait until you see an ID before getting interested you will pass over a lot of gold.

I then went thru each Threshold level from 3 to 16 and with my eyes closed went over the bare ground then the target area and kept upping the Volume starting at Vol 2 each time, until I got to the max background hum I felt willing to accept & then noted the response on the target - did it stand out from the background well?

I found that I could get an acceptable background hum & target response for any threshold from Threshold 13 Vol 3 to Threshold 6 Vol 8 with probably the sweet spot being Threshold 9 Vol 5. At the new optimum I could get a reasonable audio response at upto 60mm slate so happy with result.

Test was done with the speaker, I might have got get diff results with the wireless headphones. No doubt you would get diff result as diff target, ground, background preference etc but a least gives you an idea of how you can fine tune the unit.

 

[markie_d]

Your question about small targets got me thinking. Since using Threshold setting to sharpen up the faint target audio response also affects the background hum when there is no target, I thought I would have a look at just how the optimum Threshold setting varies with Volume Setting.

I set up the 1 grain test piece under 45mm of slate as that is the max I could get a reasonable dig-me audio only response (no ID or Bar) with starting settings as above. Note that depth is already WAY deeper than the 25mm with ID & 1 bar mentioned above showing you that if you only wait until you see an ID before getting interested you will pass over a lot of gold.

I then went thru each Threshold level from 3 to 16 and with my eyes closed went over the bare ground then the target area and kept upping the Volume starting at Vol 2 each time, until I got to the max background hum I felt willing to accept & then noted the response on the target - did it stand out from the background well?

I found that I could get an acceptable background hum & target response for any threshold from Threshold 13 Vol 3 to Threshold 6 Vol 8 with probably the sweet spot being Threshold 9 Vol 5. At the new optimum I could get a reasonable audio response at upto 60mm slate so happy with result.

Test was done with the speaker, I might have got get diff results with the wireless headphones. No doubt you would get diff result as diff target, ground, background preference etc but a least gives you an idea of how you can fine tune the unit.

HI XLOOX,
Interesting - I took the detector out for the first time over the weekend, I took a few small pieces of gold with me to the field so i could do some tests with during setup. I ended up running the detector on
Gain 85
Thresh 12 (Volume 4- 6)
isat - 2 (in one area i ended up running on about 4, cause the ground was doing strange things)
Tracking - 0 (off)
I wasen't lucky enough to find any gold, but, With the above set up i was finding very small shot gun pellets. so it has shown promising results, Now i just have to swing it over a piece of Gold. hahaha.
I may have to do some more testings in different areas.

On the second day, i started to experiment with the tone. I found that a higher tone pitch seemed to be more sensitive (does this make any sense, or am i just imagining things) i ended up running my Tone on 65.

I also tried the other modes, TBH, I'm not sure if i like them. I think i will stick to gen for now.

Now i might have to start learning more about the ground/ forest i'm working, so i can actually locate some of this shiny stuff.... hahaha

Thanks mate.

 

[XLOOX]

I dont think the detector itself is more sensitive at higher Tone settings but most probably your ears are more sensitive at those frequencies and it is the combination of the two that counts. Peoples hearing sensitivity over the frequency range differs wildly due to age, industrial deafness, personal preference,tinnitus etc which is why no matter what audio solution someone says is great, someone else says its crap. If it works for you then it works for you !

For gold prospecting there is no good reason to ever use any Mode other then Gen unless the ground is so bad ( mineralised or trashy) that you are overwhelmed by the signal clutter, are audio fatigued and cant pick the targets. Then I would try another mode (Try Boost+ EUD first,then Boost, then Fast and give Micro a miss) as the silent threshold and masking will be a relief. Yes in theory you lose depth vs Gen but you would be losing same if not more depth from the impact of the clutter.

 

[gragagan]

Bought one of these a few years ago off ebay (pretty sure from phasetech).
I've just had to purchase a new charging cable.
It seems that the detector itself can survive being in a house submerged under floodwater, being tossed around with the furniture and everything else, then left covered in thick sludgy mud when the water subsided, then thrown in a shed and forgotten about for 3 months. It still seems to work fine. Being waterproof to 5 metres or something like that definitely helps.

 

[OzzieAu]

It is a Nokta mate..... they build ‘em tough

 

[PhaseTech]

Wow, sorry to hear that. I guess that's one unexpected bonus of a fully waterproof detector.

 

[XLOOX]

Just had an intruiging couple of experiences with my Gold Kruzer....

Now not knocking the mighty 6000( esp as I want one !) but I met an experienced prospector who had just found a 0.2g piece with his 6000 and then saw another similar one sunbaking on his throwout pile. To his surprise it didnt register at all on his 6000, nor on his partners. My sdc would only see it when touching the coil but the Gold Kruzer sang at 100mm!! We went thru that 3x3m area for 3 days to 200mm deep like a fine tooth comb and the 6000 saw 3 more pieces and the Gold Kruzer with 7.5x4DD saw 10 pieces 2 scoops deep that the 6000 couldnt see when on the coil!!

The other experience was not quite so complimentary to the Kruzer. It was playing in a slatey creek bed. A Nox800 wound out to the max was screaming at everything and the numbers dancing on the screen all over the place but when we saw a 1or 2 come up we would wave it again over that spot and if still 1 or 2 came up then we would def find a real target (shot or 0.2g gold). The Kruzer, 9.5x5DD even at Gen, 85 gain, isat1, threshold 10 and vol 10 was very well behaved, unfortunately so well behaved it didnt see anything !! Even waving it over the spots the nox found wouldnt give a dig me noise!

 

[Tasprospector]

If you just dig by ID alone you will miss the very smallest & very largest nuggets as well as the deepest ones.

Just try what I suggested above with detecting under soil/rocks at different depths. As the signal fades the ID drops as well - I have nuggets that are a solid 35 or solid 45 in the air but as you bury them deeper the signal drops down into iron range (09-25) at 2 bars target and then into hot rock range (03-07) at 1 bar target & finally at max depth no ID or target bar ( maybe 1 bar flickering) but still has a distinct zip/zip audible.

Going the other way I have a 24k 0.5g gold coin that comes up solid 85 ID in the air and a couple of 1/2 oz nuggets that when close to the surface also ID well above 44. Thing is at shallow depths these of course give maxxed out 5 bar target signals.

So for me I always consider target strength bars and audio sound as well as ID before deciding dig or not.

If it is a solid signal above 28 I dig it every time even though that means some iron, lead & brass.

If it is a 2 bar signal in iron range I will scrape 25mm & see what happens to signal & ID. If ID increases I will scrape more.

If it is a hot rock/ no ID signal I will make a call based on the ground and sharpness of the zip/zip & decide to have a scrape or not.

If it is an iron range signal & 4-5 bar strength I will try at 90 degrees . If still iron ID then I walk away.

If it is 85 -95 ID I still dig but to date it has all been Alu. One day it will be a silver coin

Note that for large targets they will ID higher than "normal", as will targets with holes. I have seen 25mm aperture galv screen ID at 85, rusty washers at 65 & a pick head at 45.

Hey mate,

When you refer to bar signal, what are you refering to?

 

[XLOOX]

Hey mate,

When you refer to bar signal, what are you refering to?

I am refering to "Depth" which is really just signal strength. It is the 5 bars on the display.

You will get a distinct zip-zip sound as you wave the coil over a target. If the target is close to its depth limit of detection then you just get the zip-zip sound, a depth bar might flicker but you get no ID number. If you scrape even 25mm the signal will get rapidly stronger and the ID number will show & the number of depth bars will increase ( assuming that the target is big enough to generate a stronger signal). By the time you have 3 depth bars then it is more likely the ID number is accurate so you can then decide to dig further or walk away.

In principle you should scrape every no bar zip-zip signal to see what happens to the signal as you get deeper. If you are getting a zip-zip every 5min or more then it is reasonable to investigate each signal further but if you are getting a zip-zip every 30 sec you simply cant afford to dig each signal so you wait until you have a stronger signal to warrant a scrape.