Have you ever noticed?

[SCROUNGER]

Just having a think about getting a clear identifiable signal with a detector. Has anyone ever noticed how often a very feint signal can be really enhanced by the removal of only a few millimetres of quartz/ironstone gravel, top soil or leaves? I run my coil on the ground, literally scraping it at times, and yet just taking 10mm off the top (or removal of leaves) makes a huge difference to get a clearer signal. The quality of the signal often seems so out of proportion to the reduction of distance between coil and gold.
Is this because the stones and leaf litter, and air space is making it harder to get a clear signal or is it simply the reduction of space between the two?

 

[Metamorphic]

Both, and hots on your tuning....if its louder as you go down deeper, its a fairdinkum target

 

[Wally69]

The SDC loves to be in contact with the ground. Don't know why, but I am one of many who carry a rake and put it to work if they find a run of gold.

 

[Guest]

Hey scrounger I don't know the answer to that but lack of expertise has never stopped me giving an uneducated opinion. :lol:

I think that the detector possibly transmits and receives the signals better when in direct contact with the ground. I think that air gaps between the coil and the ground may not get the best results?

I use the boot scrape method a lot as well.

Its only a theory, someone smarter than me should be able to help us?

Cheers

RS

 

[Metamorphic]

I totally agree lads....if your not scraping the coil, your missing some gold.

 

[AtomRat]

My mate with his SDC never leaves the ground and always carries spare scratch plates. The SDC is a great subgrammer, and keeping it close as possible to the ground will help find those smaller bits.

But just like any detector, removing 1" of top matter, opens up 1" depper of new ground the detector can reach. Its why you see some clear scraped / raked areas even though its not reccommended.

 

[user 1769]

For the little tiddlers it seems to make a huge difference, because the SDC picks them clearly, but only at a very short distance. Sometimes just a light scrape with the boot (only removes a couple of mm of dirt and the leaves, twigs and pebbles) brings a clear signal out of something you weren't sure you might be imagining. Sometimes I get just the slightest unsteadiness or warble in the threshold, and I always investigate it further by scraping the ground clean. I've got a few tiny tiddlers that weighed under 0.05 g that way.

 

[SCROUNGER]

Yeah, i agree with you mfdes, sometimes i almost feel as though i have sensed something through the headphones rather than getting a noticeable signal. More often than not once i do a boot scrape there is a definite clear signal. Mind you, it's not always gold :lol:

 

[SteelPat]

I have always thought that scrapping the ground with the coil is the best method-- until I got the GPZ. For some reason it performs better having the coil slightly above the ground.

 

[mbasko]

Sweeping the Coil
CAUTION Sweeping the coil incorrectly may cause you to miss targets or generate false signals.
You will obtain the best performance when the coil is swept close and parallel to the ground at all times. This will increase detection depth and improve the response to small objects. "Avoid excessive brushing of the coil on the ground."
Though the coil assembly is rigid and durable, sudden jolts or bangs can cause random signals, as well as excessive wear and tear. Careful sweeping will ensure the coil performs optimally at all times.

Might explain why some people are having some issues with the GPZ. Used to scrubbing with other Minelabs they may not have read the manual?

Scrubbing the coil has been the norm for every detector I've owned/used.
The Zed with it's extra horsepower & sensitivity appears to be different - another habit to break!

Scraping some dirt off or removing debris from faint/iffy signals has been the norm also & helped brighten up signals on every one I've had - Minelabs SDC2300, SD2200D, GPC3500 & GPX5000 + Whites GMT..

 

[PhaseTech]

Yes.
I often run SDC training sessions, and while there is not much to go through in terms of settings, through the session I continuously stress: Low, Slow and Overlap.
And make sure I demo it on a few iffy targets, and get the trainees to try it on their machines - this is when it sinks in, as they see how easy it is to miss targets.

GPZ no no's:

1. Sensitivity too high
2. Scraping the coil
3. Sweeping too fast
4. Adjusting settings to get it to run super smooth
5. Pressing the quick trak button often

Some or most of the above is how we have run GPX's for years.

 

[nuggetino]

I found in highly mineralized ground in Kalgoorlie I couldn't scrape the ground with the ocil without making ground noise. Do people find i'st better to dramatically lower the sensitivity of your detector to allow stability while scraping the ground in these conditions or run at increased sensitivity and hovering the coil a cm above?

 

[Metamorphic]

Well i tried to ignore but the constant flow of crap here breaks my balls.

The manual....its the holy grail for the zed is it?????......please guys!

Type of ground, location and mineralization, depth and size of target, lay in the ground, junk masking nearby, swing technique, the dog pissed where i was detecting, must have a bearing no??

Adjusting settings to get it to run super smooth is a no no for the Z??? WTF

Inuendo from desktop jockey wanna be's.

I dont give a rats if you dont like me, but i cant sit by and let other members be influenced by bullshit unsubstantiated opinions.

Reading the web data may be considered knowledge to some,....experience on the ground is the only kind of reinforcement to the true army troops.

Faaark me!

 

[SteelPat]

Well i tried to ignore but the constant flow of crap here breaks my balls.

The manual....its the holy grail for the zed is it?????......please guys!

Type of ground, location and mineralization, depth and size of target, lay in the ground, junk masking nearby, swing technique, the dog pissed where i was detecting, must have a bearing no??

Adjusting settings to get it to run super smooth is a no no for the Z??? WTF

Inuendo from desktop jockey wanna be's.

I dont give a rats if you dont like me, but i cant sit by and let other members be influenced by bullshit unsubstantiated opinions.

Reading the web data may be considered knowledge to some,....experience on the ground is the only kind of reinforcement to the true army troops.

Faaark me!

Not sure why you are so Pi$$ed off. My quote comes from MY experience with MY Zed, not from being a desktop jockey wanna be.

I am pretty sure PhaseTech is speaking from experience as well.

As this is new machine and no one has all the answers yet, if users get together and share their experiences, everyone can learn.

 

[silver]

Yeah but we all know that we don't share everything right,.... it's sort of like those famous recipes of my mums that she gets accused of leaving some ingredient out of, because no one can ever cook it the same as she can(ha),.... I recon good on her if she does,.... nothing like the hard yards put in personaly to get it right and refine those abilities, we can have all the ingredients right but the personal method is just that sometimes,.. personal, we may give up a few snippets here and there for everyone, but it gets down to those hard yards to put it all together and come up with those personal Ureaka moments that bring that all knowing smile to ones face.(and I'm only still on an ACE250 fellas, but I feel for ya's).

 

[mbasko]

Well i tried to ignore but the constant flow of crap here breaks my balls.

The manual....its the holy grail for the zed is it?????......please guys!

Type of ground, location and mineralization, depth and size of target, lay in the ground, junk masking nearby, swing technique, the dog pissed where i was detecting, must have a bearing no??

Adjusting settings to get it to run super smooth is a no no for the Z??? WTF

Inuendo from desktop jockey wanna be's.

I dont give a rats if you dont like me, but i cant sit by and let other members be influenced by bullshit unsubstantiated opinions.

Reading the web data may be considered knowledge to some,....experience on the ground is the only kind of reinforcement to the true army troops.

Faaark me!

The manual may not be the holy grail but it is a good starting point as are the white papers put out.
Sorry Meta but your post is full of innuendo! If you have so much experience & knowledge to offer on the GPZ put it up for the benefit of all Zed users. Don't disparage people like Nenad for stating their experience/findings!
For someone with less than 2 years experience gold detecting you have a big opinion of yourself. As the old saying goes "put up or shut up". We are all just trying to help here not bullshit people.
If more people had read & understood that worthless tome known as the manual (although it didn't help not being supplied with the GPZ) then less issues may have been raised initially. Granted - on the ground use is the best experience there is & most work out their own preferred methods + modes of operation through practical trial & error. Just my opinion - not the holy grail of innuendo & misinformation.

 

[Kerro]

Just having a think about getting a clear identifiable signal with a detector. Has anyone ever noticed how often a very feint signal can be really enhanced by the removal of only a few millimetres of quartz/ironstone gravel, top soil or leaves? I run my coil on the ground, literally scraping it at times, and yet just taking 10mm off the top (or removal of leaves) makes a huge difference to get a clearer signal. The quality of the signal often seems so out of proportion to the reduction of distance between coil and gold.
Is this because the stones and leaf litter, and air space is making it harder to get a clear signal or is it simply the reduction of space between the two?

Minelab cover this briefly in their knowledge base article, page 13, signal strength - http://www.minelab.com/__files/f/11043/KBA_METAL_DETECTOR_BASICS_&_THEORY.pdf

It is more or less related to how the signal propagates through the medium to the target and back again, so yes the distance and signal strength are not linearly related - good observation

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law

 

[SCROUNGER]

Thanks Kerro, the technical stuff makes my head hurt to be quite honest. :lol: I was out again yesterday with the sdc and even simply brushing aside the 5mm size rough stuff sitting above the surfaced clay makes a huge difference. Scrape away 10-15mm and you'd think you're onto a grammer rather than a tiny spec :lol: Another thing i've also noticed with the sdc is that if i get the very slightest of signals when going slow, i can often get an enhanced signal by speeding up the swing. So generally i go slow and then increase the speed (marginally) to increase the signal and pin point it more accurately.

 

[Heatho]

I think a lot of people who got on board early with the SD, GP series and then 4500 and 5000 got lucky on the gold, settings matter less than actually getting a coil over nuggets. Most of the easy gold is gone from public areas and people are freaking out that the 7000 doesn't work because they can't find any significant nugs hammering the same old spots. This is the time to re-evaluate one's skills as a prospector and not blame the tools I think. There are obviously some dodgy units but most seem to be finding some gold at least.

It is a new machine and needs to be treated as such with a different methodology but I guess it's hard to teach an old dog new tricks as well.

Not trying to offend anyone, just my observations.

 

[Metamorphic]

Well i tried to ignore but the constant flow of crap here breaks my balls.

The manual....its the holy grail for the zed is it?????......please guys!

Type of ground, location and mineralization, depth and size of target, lay in the ground, junk masking nearby, swing technique, the dog pissed where i was detecting, must have a bearing no??

Adjusting settings to get it to run super smooth is a no no for the Z??? WTF

Inuendo from desktop jockey wanna be's.

I dont give a rats if you dont like me, but i cant sit by and let other members be influenced by bullshit unsubstantiated opinions.

Reading the web data may be considered knowledge to some,....experience on the ground is the only kind of reinforcement to the true army troops.

Faaark me!

The manual may not be the holy grail but it is a good starting point as are the white papers put out.
Sorry Meta but your post is full of innuendo! If you have so much experience & knowledge to offer on the GPZ put it up for the benefit of all Zed users. Don't disparage people like Nenad for stating their experience/findings!
For someone with less than 2 years experience gold detecting you have a big opinion of yourself. As the old saying goes "put up or shut up". We are all just trying to help here not bullshit people.
If more people had read & understood that worthless tome known as the manual (although it didn't help not being supplied with the GPZ) then less issues may have been raised initially. Granted - on the ground use is the best experience there is & most work out their own preferred methods + modes of operation through practical trial & error. Just my opinion - not the holy grail of innuendo & misinformation.

Mate, a manual will teach you nothing except how to try and decipher what is in print.

I dont mean to disparge anyone, no member is singled out here, its just my way of coming across which you all know is no fuss!

Too much essence on user guides rather than getting on the dirt, thats all.

Detectors will never make you recover your costs as a prospector, Zed or no Zed.....dont care what anyone says. Unless you are incredibly lucky.
I do understand that most here are in it for the adventure, the fun and a weekend away....not for the $$$

You read me wrong, Im not here to gain popularity votes, im here to tell it how it is..... and I dont really care if you think im not genuine in my cause, values or experience.

You know all about this game im sure, your experience may exceed all here..... im cool with that!

Even if you did read it all online.