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Bullion.Forum
generators and battery chargeing.
- Thread starter Davent
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Read what you like davent, but remember that every problem will be posted, whereas every unit that gives excellent service goes unnoticed. I've got one (ArcPak730 with 130AH Exide AGM), and haven't posted how good it is - why would I - it's doing only what I expected, i.e.: working just fine.
well i can get one at the right price no worries......just banking on it doing what they say it will. Read on a lot of forums about continually blowing fuses, and not charging from 240......not just 1 or 2 isolated problems, lots of them. I really like the idea of the 730, but if it craps out on day 1 at tennant creek, i have another 8 days out bush with just the battery again....
I've spare fuses, and they are easily replaced, but not blown 1 so far. I could easily blow some by overloading the 300W inverter, taking too much current from the 12V outputs etc, but that is just user error. I can't advise further. Just saying - I've got one and it does its job.
Hi, Davent, mate i have been using the arkpak for 3 yrs with a 110ah battery.
Runs 45ltr engel fridge,2 led light strips all up approx 4amp per hr.
I also charage 4500 battery every night.Also phone and laptop from USB port.
Charaged with 160 wat solar,set up to catch morning sun reposioned lunch time
for afternoon sun. The arkpak has a charage indicator on it,lowest mine dropped to
was 48% charaged on a 2 week camp out up Georgetown way.
5 x 7day trips to Clermont no probs.You can top up arkpak while driving if no sun.
Do have Atomic 700w 5 aph gennie and ctek 5ah dc/dc charger,never had to use them.
I set the arkpak with fridge,lights and solar at home left every thing run for 4 days,
battery dropped to 62% by morning back to 100% by afternoon. Using 4ah putting 7ah back
in from solar. Mate i would highly recommend the 750 arkpak. The arkpak 2 notas good.
Will hook up with ya July TC. Rember the Roast.
Polky.
Runs 45ltr engel fridge,2 led light strips all up approx 4amp per hr.
I also charage 4500 battery every night.Also phone and laptop from USB port.
Charaged with 160 wat solar,set up to catch morning sun reposioned lunch time
for afternoon sun. The arkpak has a charage indicator on it,lowest mine dropped to
was 48% charaged on a 2 week camp out up Georgetown way.
5 x 7day trips to Clermont no probs.You can top up arkpak while driving if no sun.
Do have Atomic 700w 5 aph gennie and ctek 5ah dc/dc charger,never had to use them.
I set the arkpak with fridge,lights and solar at home left every thing run for 4 days,
battery dropped to 62% by morning back to 100% by afternoon. Using 4ah putting 7ah back
in from solar. Mate i would highly recommend the 750 arkpak. The arkpak 2 notas good.
Will hook up with ya July TC. Rember the Roast.
Polky.
Advent,
A few more reviews to ponder;
http://www.productreview.com.au/p/ark-arkpak.html
http://www.pradopoint.com/showthread.php?34041-New-version-of-the-ArkPak-(AP730)
Peter
A few more reviews to ponder;
http://www.productreview.com.au/p/ark-arkpak.html
http://www.pradopoint.com/showthread.php?34041-New-version-of-the-ArkPak-(AP730)
Peter
I keep mine on house power most of the time - just keeps the battery conditioned. You'd have 2 options running from a genny:
1. Plug the ArcPak directly to the 240V genie output, or
2. Use your charger plugged directly to the ArcPak's battery posts.
My concern re option 1 would be the cleanliness of the 240V output from the genie. Gennie's do strange things when switching loads or running short on fuel. Do you trust it? Mabbe this is the cause of some of the reported faults re charging from 240Vac.
My concern re option 2 (as Condor stated) would be having a charger suited to an AGM.
Solar on your trailer roof, with an AGM output would also be an option. So many options!
1. Plug the ArcPak directly to the 240V genie output, or
2. Use your charger plugged directly to the ArcPak's battery posts.
My concern re option 1 would be the cleanliness of the 240V output from the genie. Gennie's do strange things when switching loads or running short on fuel. Do you trust it? Mabbe this is the cause of some of the reported faults re charging from 240Vac.
My concern re option 2 (as Condor stated) would be having a charger suited to an AGM.
Solar on your trailer roof, with an AGM output would also be an option. So many options!
Didn't notice you already have a solar paneldavent said:
Have a 64W solar on roof of ute wired to a regulator which inturn charges a AGM battery permanently mounted.
Over summer I rewired my eBay foldup 120W portable panels from parallel to series with an Anderson plug. These panels are connected to same battery via Anderson/ MPPT 75/10 regulator. Recent trip this set up proved its worth.
When we pull up at our detecting spot the portable is plugged in. There are two Engels on the tray an old yellow 39L running as a freezer, the control is set so it cycles on approx. -7C. The other Engel is a 80L Combo.
***Word of caution if you go this way don't forget to stow portable onboard before driving off." We have driven away twice but fortunately the Anderson has separated and no resulting damage to panels. Whew!
Davent, seems like the jury is against the ArcPak. I'm OK with that. Maybe I'm just luck, as mine gets a 5 star 
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One thing I have learned after lots of time in the bush is keep it simple mate. The ARK paks are for mobile power solution and are not built for a punishing use or high tempretures we get up here and you have it even worse being in the NT. A good AGM or even a Lead Acid if your budget does not allow a good AGM, good DC to DC charger I use the RedArc BCDC1225 as it also has a MPPT solar regulator and have had this unit for about 4 years and have used it alot worth it's price trust me and the big advantage is only one anderson plug on front of trailer into the ute or solar panels and at least 160 watt solar but that is what you have. Then have a 10 or 15 amp Ctek charger hooked into the line so when you plug your gennie into it it will charge you up quick smart or the mains when you get home to keep it topped up and conditioned
and I also have a Victron BMV702 Battery Monitor just to keep an eye on what is going on but no that important if you have a voltage meter. Very simple way of doing things and my trailer has 2 x 120 amp AGM's and with 200 watt solar panels a 1 kva gennie 20 litres of fuel 2 weeks of camping is easy with a fridge, freezer and lights.
condor22
Mike
The Arkpak 739 has a 7amp AC & 7 amp DC charger inbuilt. It would take some time to replace 30-40 AH into a 105 AH AGM. In other word its charger is on the small side.
ie. A smart charger (as in the Arkpak) is in boost when the battery is down below approx. 80% charge (depends on the charger, temperature etc). It is at this point the charger puts in its maximum (7 amps for the Arkpak) when the battery is somewhere between 80 & 90% charged, the charger moves into Absorption mode, where it has a fixed voltage depending on battery type and a reducing current (amps).
It is this stage that takes the longest to complete as the battery gets nearer to 100% the charging amps reduce to a point ( for a 7A charger about 1-2 amps for the last 5%) where the charger senses the battery is charged. The charger then moves into float mode with a fixed voltage (about 13.3 V) and maintains the battery at a fully charged state.
Some charges like the Redarc BCDC range or Projecta Intellicharge, will sense a load on the battery and will not leave absorption and enter float state until the battery load is less than 4A for 30 seconds.
Having said this, if you say use 35 AH from a 105 AH battery it will charge the first 20 or so amps at 7 amps per hour (approx. 3 hours).
Then in Absorption it could take another 3 hours or more to reach float. Another reason to charge often and keep the depth of cycle as low as possible.
This means running a genny for 6 hours to fully charge the battery. If the battery charger is twice the output ie a 15 amp charger then all charging stages are approximately halved. Which is less genny time.
Conversely, a 30A charger or bigger is most likely going to, in simple terms, "gonna shove too much in too quickly" which means the battery will get much hotter and if too quick can go "bang".
That is why I along with the experts quote between 10 & 20% of capacity for an AGM.......
I'm not saying the Arkpak is not a useful item, all I am saying is that if you only rely on a genny to charge a 100+ AH AGM be prepare to run the genny for longer...... So in vehicle whilst driving should be another charging option.
ie. A smart charger (as in the Arkpak) is in boost when the battery is down below approx. 80% charge (depends on the charger, temperature etc). It is at this point the charger puts in its maximum (7 amps for the Arkpak) when the battery is somewhere between 80 & 90% charged, the charger moves into Absorption mode, where it has a fixed voltage depending on battery type and a reducing current (amps).
It is this stage that takes the longest to complete as the battery gets nearer to 100% the charging amps reduce to a point ( for a 7A charger about 1-2 amps for the last 5%) where the charger senses the battery is charged. The charger then moves into float mode with a fixed voltage (about 13.3 V) and maintains the battery at a fully charged state.
Some charges like the Redarc BCDC range or Projecta Intellicharge, will sense a load on the battery and will not leave absorption and enter float state until the battery load is less than 4A for 30 seconds.
Having said this, if you say use 35 AH from a 105 AH battery it will charge the first 20 or so amps at 7 amps per hour (approx. 3 hours).
Then in Absorption it could take another 3 hours or more to reach float. Another reason to charge often and keep the depth of cycle as low as possible.
This means running a genny for 6 hours to fully charge the battery. If the battery charger is twice the output ie a 15 amp charger then all charging stages are approximately halved. Which is less genny time.
Conversely, a 30A charger or bigger is most likely going to, in simple terms, "gonna shove too much in too quickly" which means the battery will get much hotter and if too quick can go "bang".
That is why I along with the experts quote between 10 & 20% of capacity for an AGM.......
I'm not saying the Arkpak is not a useful item, all I am saying is that if you only rely on a genny to charge a 100+ AH AGM be prepare to run the genny for longer...... So in vehicle whilst driving should be another charging option.
You're spot on Condor. Leave it connected in vehicle whilst driving (7% is low but will do whilst travelling), and you'll only need your gennie or solar when stopped for extended periods.
condor22
Mike
I totally agree with Goldwright.
(Although noted in other threads)
My van's 120 AH AGM is charged with the following;
A Projecta Intellicharge 15 Amp, 240 VAC smart charger when on mains power, or from my genny.
A Redarc BCDC1220 20AH DC to DC charger in the van near the battery, which charges the van battery when driving as my 3 way fridge load is about 14 amps.
A Victron 30 amp solar regulator driven by 2 x 100 W solar panels with individually circuit breakers (to isolate one or both) And, I run a Diesel heater overnight which adds to battery load. My load on a night I run the heater, lights and TV etc is 35-40 AH, the panels I use were $5-600 each, but have fully charged that use by 1pm on an average winters day.
The reason I have a 30 A solar regulator is that the 2 panels only output about 14 amps, the Victron is smart enough to charge at about that rate not at 30 amps.
I used this regulator because I have the space to add 2 more 100W panels which the regulator will handle, but only if I also double my battery capacity to 2 x 120 AH AGMs. I don't need to do this at present, because when off grid I run the fridge on LPG. If I later decide to replace the fridge with a 12 V compressor fridge, then that is when I double up on the panels and battery.
As I said before, you get what you pay for and when things go wrong, which they can by cutting corners, they can end a trip. Believe me I know.
Last years prospecting trip, I had an issue with the fridge on LPG when free camping. To spare the detail, the end result was 4 days without a fridge, losing all my frozen food, half my fridge food, numerous mobile calls, several trips to a local town, several nights in a van park (on 240V, the fridge was OK) and over $200 I hadn't budgeted for, I finally got it fixed. And, this was not caused by cutting corners!
Do it right, do it Once........
(Although noted in other threads)
My van's 120 AH AGM is charged with the following;
A Projecta Intellicharge 15 Amp, 240 VAC smart charger when on mains power, or from my genny.
A Redarc BCDC1220 20AH DC to DC charger in the van near the battery, which charges the van battery when driving as my 3 way fridge load is about 14 amps.
A Victron 30 amp solar regulator driven by 2 x 100 W solar panels with individually circuit breakers (to isolate one or both) And, I run a Diesel heater overnight which adds to battery load. My load on a night I run the heater, lights and TV etc is 35-40 AH, the panels I use were $5-600 each, but have fully charged that use by 1pm on an average winters day.
The reason I have a 30 A solar regulator is that the 2 panels only output about 14 amps, the Victron is smart enough to charge at about that rate not at 30 amps.
I used this regulator because I have the space to add 2 more 100W panels which the regulator will handle, but only if I also double my battery capacity to 2 x 120 AH AGMs. I don't need to do this at present, because when off grid I run the fridge on LPG. If I later decide to replace the fridge with a 12 V compressor fridge, then that is when I double up on the panels and battery.
As I said before, you get what you pay for and when things go wrong, which they can by cutting corners, they can end a trip. Believe me I know.
Last years prospecting trip, I had an issue with the fridge on LPG when free camping. To spare the detail, the end result was 4 days without a fridge, losing all my frozen food, half my fridge food, numerous mobile calls, several trips to a local town, several nights in a van park (on 240V, the fridge was OK) and over $200 I hadn't budgeted for, I finally got it fixed. And, this was not caused by cutting corners!
Do it right, do it Once........
condor22
Mike
BigWave said:
Spot on as well
Also stated in other threads.......
My Engel 30 litre, 23 yr old in the back of the 4x4 runs about 25AH on a 25 C day, but on a 40 C day it is nearer if not more than 60AH, so keep that in mind if out in the summer
condor22
Mike
Here's a comparrison for anyone interested. Prices as quoted on their Web Site - Home of 12Volt SA.
A Full River 120AH AGM is $389. (the one I have) My previous 4x4 AGM lasted over 9 years (Redarc charged
A 30AH Thumper from the same supplier is $429 (what I had many years ago) It lasted 2 years charging from the alternator via cig socket.
Why would you pay $40 more for a battery pack for a 1/4 of the capacity. It's lot to pay for a few cig sockets, Anderson connectors, voltmeter and a couple of handles.
Also, it is my understanding that prices quoted for an Arkpak, is for the box only and does not include a battery. I'll stand corrected if this is wrong.....
A Full River 120AH AGM is $389. (the one I have) My previous 4x4 AGM lasted over 9 years (Redarc charged
A 30AH Thumper from the same supplier is $429 (what I had many years ago) It lasted 2 years charging from the alternator via cig socket.
Why would you pay $40 more for a battery pack for a 1/4 of the capacity. It's lot to pay for a few cig sockets, Anderson connectors, voltmeter and a couple of handles.
Also, it is my understanding that prices quoted for an Arkpak, is for the box only and does not include a battery. I'll stand corrected if this is wrong.....
ok, so I need to get a good charger.
The reason I like the idea of the ark pak, is, that this trailer will not be a dedicated camper. It is going to be used for other purposes as well.
I want to keep the inside as a normal trailer, so want removable power etc.The pipes on the top will stay, the sail track on the sides will stay. I might mount some LED light bars on the inside of the doors. But there wont be permanent power outlets, or chargers, or battery boxes mounted inside.
The 160w solar panels should power the fridge no worries. Its all the 105amh AGM has to power, as well as charge my 4500 battery, I also have a jump start pack, and one of Woody,s camcord batteries.
I was thinking of getting the arc pack because I can get one cheap from a mate who sells them, also considered a another battery or even one of the WACO 36hr packs.
I have a gennys that will fit into the trailer. So as it stands now, looks like I will probably get a an AGM compatable charger that I can plug into the generator, and later, get another AGM, and rotate the batteries.
The reason I like the idea of the ark pak, is, that this trailer will not be a dedicated camper. It is going to be used for other purposes as well.
I want to keep the inside as a normal trailer, so want removable power etc.The pipes on the top will stay, the sail track on the sides will stay. I might mount some LED light bars on the inside of the doors. But there wont be permanent power outlets, or chargers, or battery boxes mounted inside.
The 160w solar panels should power the fridge no worries. Its all the 105amh AGM has to power, as well as charge my 4500 battery, I also have a jump start pack, and one of Woody,s camcord batteries.
I was thinking of getting the arc pack because I can get one cheap from a mate who sells them, also considered a another battery or even one of the WACO 36hr packs.
I have a gennys that will fit into the trailer. So as it stands now, looks like I will probably get a an AGM compatable charger that I can plug into the generator, and later, get another AGM, and rotate the batteries.
I'm getting dizzy reading all these power combinations. Good luck Dave.
One consideration with the ark type products is you have all eggs in one basket so if the board faults would this take out all charging options? Redundancy is good to think about particularly since you already have a genset.
Jon
Jon
