Early Discovery

[fever2]

This strange sentence may mean they found a tunnel at the hill. Do you have clearer information about the discovery near Eltham, Melbourne?
"Gold was discovered at Diamond Creek in the early 1860s leading to a tunnel on the south side of Mine Hill, at the end of Dering Street, which was mined using a king-sized skip truck. " Kevin Patterson. Nillumbik Historical Society

 

[silver]

Mystery and intrigue.... .....
tell us more fever2... t e l l us m o r e !

 

[aussiefarmer]

Its worded poorly like most old newspaper exerts in the 1800s, i can only imagine the string of people news would go through to get from the goldfield into print.

But then again it looks like a qoute from kev of the histerical society and if thats the case track him down as he has the answer you seek.

To me the mention of the skip truck and the fact its called mine hill means the tunnel is a mine , being 1860 maybe they followed the gold up the creek looking for the source only to find a big gold mine either being worked or been worked in the past.

 

[fever2]

Gold was found in Adelaide hills and then north near the salt lakes where fossils are found. Legends about fossils seem to match Indonesian and Chinese traditions.

An odd combination of crocodile, building , water-springs and food-increase is seen here:

"..the Dieri perform magical ceremonies for the multiplication of their totemic animals, no doubt with the intention of thereby increasing the food-supply of the tribe... To judge from the description of him, he seems to be one of those fossil beasts or reptiles which are found in the deltas of rivers flowing into Lake Eyre. Such fossil bones are called kadimarkara by the Dieri." _James George Frazer - 1910.

"This legend professes to account for the origin of the fossilised marsupials and other creatures which are found in several places in the Lake Eyre district, and also for that of the mound springs which are so marked a feature of that part of Australia. These fossils are called by the tribes-people Kadimarkara, creatures which in the Mura-mura times descended from the sky-country to the earth, by means of great trees which grew on the eastern shores of Lake Eyre, and supported the sky. " W Howitt 1904..

"A German missionary Rev. Johann Reuther sold the fossil tree to the South Australia museum in 1907.. Aboriginal people in the area believed it was the body of a Dreaming Ancestor called Kadimarkara who died and turned into stone."

Sanskrit makara means "crocodile", usually freshwater crocs, and kadhi is "ocean", suited to salty Lake Eyre , south Australia. Both words were in Old Java language of 800-1300 CE which has about 25% Skt words. OJ kaiwas a part. kind of sea-fish . Old Java makara (Skt a kind of sea-monster, crocodile,) sculpture in makara shape on buildings (temple, bathing-place etc), often serving as waterspout;

.."as guardian of gateways, the makara image appears on the curved prongs of the vast crossed-vajra ..supports the whole structure of the mandala palace symbolizing the immovable stability of the vajra-ground on which it stands." (Beer. Handbook Tibetan Myth 2003).

"University of Indonesia as the center of the Nation's culture is symbolized by the shell of wisdom which accept the flowing water from the head of Kala Makara logo. "

"The Dieri and the Tirari both speak of these great trees. One of them stood at the Clayton River, the middle one at the Cooper about twenty-five miles west of Killalpanina, and the third at Salt Creek."

Mjizu lng zh, Makara dragon pillar . "There are four main supportive, dragon pillars.

All the buildings within the Temple of Prayer for Good Harvests in Beijing have special dark blue roof tiles, representing the Heaven".

The Makara in Early Chinese Buddhist Sculpture. J H Lindsay 2011.

In the early Buddhist cave temples made in the latter half of the fifth century a.d., during the Northern Wei dynasty, at Yim-kang, in the Shansi Province of North China, can be found several carvings of a curious creature..

India's Makara festival is for success and prosperity and goddess Lakshmi sat on a croc for that reason. "It represents a necessary state of chaos before the emergence of a new state of order."

Javanese goldminers were in Philippines 14th cent and 2 countries in east Australia have legends of boats arriving . Their apparent loan-words (like the 16 known Indic words among 200 Indonesian loans in north Australia) are consistent with South Australia's . The gold in Adelaide Hills may have induced exploration northwards as gold is mined near Marree.

This forum won't allow me to post the links but they can be Googled. I've asked the Diamond creek History group but no reply yet.

 

[user 4386]

This strange sentence may mean they found a tunnel at the hill. Do you have clearer information about the discovery near Eltham, Melbourne ?
"Gold was discovered at Diamond Creek in the early 1860s leading to a tunnel on the south side of Mine Hill, at the end of Dering Street, which was mined using a king-sized skip truck. " Kevin Patterson. Nillumbik Historical Society

What is it you are asking about the Diamond Creek gold mine - why do you find it strange?

 

[fever2]

It's possible that he's saying a tunnel already existed. My reason for asking is the connection between gold and Indonesia.
" "Warrandyte" translated as "that which is thrown". Bunjil, the great eagle, the all-powerful, ever-watchful creator of the world, had once gazed down upon his people from the Star Altair and seen their wrongdoing. Awaiting their return, with a mighty crash of thunder, he hurled down a star to destroy them. Where star struck created the gorge we see today. Bunjil's people always remembered the spot. They called it Warrandyte, .."
Source: Warrandyte Diary.

Aboriginal words - 'Warren' meaning 'to throw' and 'dyte' meaning 'the thing thrown at" ... Bunjil threw down the star'.
Joy Braybrook - 2012 - History
Warrandyte: The word meaning, 'Where the star was thrown'.

East Melbourne dyte . North Melbourne duta '"star" , north Vic. durt "star".
Old Java language 800-1300 CE. dyuh (Skt dyu-, heaven)
dyuti (cf Skt jyotis) heavenly bodies .

wara (Skt) act or object of choosing, most excellent among. (wara-ne possessive : "star of choosing").
wraa (Skt wraa, warding off, resisting).
wara* waraan a part. colour? (yellowish? reddish?).
" . the first recognised Gold Field in Victoria in 1851, at Andersons Creek near Warrandyte". ( were nuggets seen as the remnants of the star?).

"In the puranas, the Sudarshana Chakra was made by the architect of gods, Vishvakarma. Vishvakarma's daughter Sanjana was married to Surya. Due to the Sun's blazing light and heat, she could not go near the Sun. She complained to her father about this. Vishvakarma made the sun shine less so that his daughter could hug the Sun. The left over stardust was collected by Vishvakarma and made into Sudarshana Chakra of Vishnu. The Chakra is described to have 10 million spikes in two rows moving in opposite directions to give it a serrated edge.

Sudarshana Chakra was used to cut the corpse of Sati, the consort of Shiva into 51 pieces after she gave up her life by throwing herself in a yagna (fire sacrifice) of her father Daksha. Shiva, in grief, carried around her lifeless body and was inconsolable. The 51 parts of the goddess' body were then tossed about in different parts of the Indian subcontinent and became "Shakti Peethas".
According to the Ahirbudhanya Samhita, "Vishnu, in the form of Chakra, was held as the ideal of worship for kings desirous of obtaining universal sovereignty" .
"The Chakri dynasty is the current ruling royal house of the Kingdom of Thailand, since 1782 Prior to the founding of the dynasty, King Rama I held for years the title Chakri,.The emblem of the dynasty is composed of the discus (Chakra) and the trident (Trisula), the celestial weapons of god Vishnu and Shiva, whom the Thai sovereign is seen as an incarnation."

Vishnu with a chakra weapon rode Garuda eagle , identified with Aquila "eagle" stars of Altair, as is Bunjil the eagle-man.

 

[Jaros]

I'll have what he's having!!!! not. :argh:

 

[HarryHoudini]

too early in the morning ?

 

[fever2]

"Wollongong Central proudly rests on the land of the Wodi Wodi people, who are a part of the Dharawal Nation. Traditional stories tell of their arrival at the mouth of Lake Illawarra in canoes. They brought the dharawal (cabbage tree palm) with them from the north and are given their name from this sacred tree. "
Old Java dru (Skt) piece of wood, wood, timber.
wala In compounds it seems to be ``all kinds of, in every respect'' .
The tree gives a 'cabbage' stem , bangala water-bucket and roof thatch .
"to the best of knowledge the Bundjalung Nation Aboriginal people from the East Coast of Australia, the Far North Coast of New South Wales and South East Queensland area, are the only ones whose dream time stories talk about arriving in Australia from elsewhere. They came from the land "at the centre of the world" when a massive catastrophe destroyed it. "

banggalu palm tree Gold Coast Tweed , used for water-bucket.
banggam cabbage tree palm .
Javanese banglo is "bungalow" with palm thatch . Dharawal bangalay is mahogany tree used for bark-roofing. "Bungalow" is from bangla house of Bengal.

 

[Jaros]

Geez, I hope it's not catchy.... ]

 

[fever2]

Old Java nagara (Skt town, city) palace , capital, state or realm.
gta (Skt gt, song; gta, singing) song. See also magala-, rudita-, toaka-.
paragta singer(s). (Does para here indicate a plural or a group; )
gtakra (Skt) composer of songs or poems .
nagara-ne gita "song of country".

Bebejan was a Ngurungaeta of the Wurundjeri people and was present at John Batman's "treaty" signing in Melbourne 1835. Billibellary (c. 17991846) was a song maker and influential ngurungaeta of the Wurundjeri-willam clan during the early years of European settlement of Melbourne.

 

[Jaros]

I'm thinking of youth in Asia!!

 

[fever2]

Take your pick . Or wooden shovel . This young bloke had a bad hair day.
Aboriginal Murder Mystery: What Killed Kaakutja? - National Geographic

Jan 17, 2017 - At first glance, Westaway reasoned that Kaakutja's lethal injury, a long wound on his skull, had come from a cutlass blade, most likely dealt by ...
Kaakutja, Perhaps the First Known Boomerang Victim - The New York Times...

Oct 17, 2016 - The skeletal remains of Kaakutja, an aboriginal man who scientists think was killed ... A gash in the skull of Kaakutja was probably caused by a boomerang.

My butcher won't buy it , he uses a steel cleaver for bone. The smart money is on wood to slice out cortical bone. Everyone uses wooden knives in their kitchen ,right?

 

[travelergold]

So what is it that you want to know? I'm lost

 

[Jaros]

What are you trying to prove fever2?

 

[silver]

"A German missionary Rev. Johann Reuther sold the fossil tree to the South Australia museum in 1907.. Aboriginal people in the area believed it was the body of a Dreaming Ancestor called Kadimarkara who died and turned into stone." .

I just hope the museum is prepared to give this back to the original peoples.... who was this man to have felt like he could just take and sell such an object of reverence.

 

[user 4386]

This strange sentence may mean they found a tunnel at the hill. Do you have clearer information about the discovery near Eltham, Melbourne ?
"Gold was discovered at Diamond Creek in the early 1860s leading to a tunnel on the south side of Mine Hill, at the end of Dering Street, which was mined using a king-sized skip truck. " Kevin Patterson. Nillumbik Historical Society

It means that they discovered gold there in the 1860s. this resulted in them driving a tunnel into the hill (I used to go in it as a kid) - then they sunk a 960 foot deep shaft and produced 1.6 tonnes of hard-rock gold. "Skip" is still the term commonly used for the container used to haul out the ore. Question?

Boy, you are pushing the analogies....

 

[user 4386]

https://janhawkinsau.wordpress.com/2013/11/13/prehistoric-australia-the-kadimakara/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kadimakara_australiensis

I had not heard that Dieri one about the giant tree - I thought it was multiple trees, but I doubt that anyone pinched that one -there are fossilised trees everywhere in that area around Coopers Creek (and megafauna bones). Recently megafauna bones were found with aboriginal tool marks, so they coexisted with (and possibly extinguished) some megafauna.

 

[user 4386]

Reuther did live with the Dieri and knew their language - he was interested in botany and collected many plants (including for the South Australian museum).

We are finding that some aboriginal legends are actually factual observations (that there was no sea in Port Phillip Bay, that there were major meteorite showers that they observed). It is true that there were major forests and inland rivers, and the area only dried up around 6.000 to 9,000 years ago (and impacted on the aborigines) e.g. Lake Mungo. where we see fish bones in their campfires from when it held fresh water. Many of the rounded stones of the gibber planes are actually river pebbles.

But I would not push analogies too far (ganja?)

 

[Jaros]

Where is all this going fever2.