DEEP CYCLE BATTERIES and BUSH POWER

[user 22230]

PS, the solar conditions of FNQ are vastly different to winter in central VIC.
Born n bred Chewton which is pretty central Vic and built quite a few mud brick homes around Fryerstown, Chewton area that have been off grid for 30+ years and still are. But apology for breaking in on the convo guys . Good luck with it all as certainly looks impressive .................... on paper

 

[Ridge Runner]

PS, the solar conditions of FNQ are vastly different to winter in central VIC.
Born n bred Chewton which is pretty central Vic and built quite a few mud brick homes around Fryerstown, Chewton area that have been off grid for 30+ years and still are. But apology for breaking in on the convo guys . Good luck with it all as certainly looks impressive .................... on paper

No apology needed, your just as important as any other member here and this convo is as much yours as it is ours,

 

[condor22]

I'm back from a few days out with the van and the upgraded solar. Attached are 3 images from the PM300 display unit. It shows the date, time and other data. The important values are the time (centre top) Battery State of Charge (SOC) % (large value lower right) and the Amps solar is producing lower left next to the little sun symbol). FYI the large figure when Amps is the load (below the temp.) and the Amps value above the battery SOC %.

Also the load is actual i.e. fridge and the Amp figure is the net charge, not the actual as it subtracts the load.

 

[condor22]

At 0929 (1st image) it was cloudy. At 0930 the sun came out, hence the increase in solar. As I have 200Ah of Lithium, 86% represents 28Ah to full. The last image shows the SOC at 99% only 100 minutes later.

I had the 2 x 150W Hardkorr panels connected as well as the 160 on roof Chinese panel for 460W total, all in parallel. Weather was 2/3 cloudy with occasional sunny periods.

In the days before, I arrived Monday and had the panels deployed by noon. Tuesday morning SOC was 80%. However, it was rain most of Tuesday, with no sun at all. Wednesday morning, SOC was 60% (80Ah down). Weather was 50-50 cloud/sun and the batteries were full by 4pm.

Although I took the generator (just in case) it never got started. My conclusion - gotta be happy with that, lol.
I didn't bother testing the Hardkorr in Series as the roof panel would not get used because the total voltage exceeds the PM300 rated voltage.

 

[Ridge Runner]

So in fairly bad conditions you were fully charged by 11am / 1 hr 40mins, Thats an overall average of 16.8A per hour, thats pretty awesome,

I think you have proved just how good lithium can be under adverse conditions, Imagine what the results would be in the height of Summer,

 

[Hawkear]

Have not long ago bought a small pop top to help spend more time around the goldfields.
The AGM battery in the van seems to be on its last legs. As far as I can tell all the battery seems to do is run the led lights in the van.
For the immediate future we will just be staying at caravan parks with 240v supply so we don’t want to spend a heap on upgraded van electricals. That would be something to consider later when we may consider some off grid camps.
So for now, just thinking of dropping in a similar Lithium as replacement.
From what I have read the Lithium battery may not become fully charged using the existing van electricals but have also read that Lithiums don’t mind delivering power when less than fully charged so may not be a problem.
Question. Has anyone actually dropped a Lithium in to replace an AGM in a caravan without altering the van electricals and what was the result?

 

[Ridge Runner]

Have not long ago bought a small pop top to help spend more time around the goldfields.
The AGM battery in the van seems to be on its last legs. As far as I can tell all the battery seems to do is run the led lights in the van.
For the immediate future we will just be staying at caravan parks with 240v supply so we don’t want to spend a heap on upgraded van electricals. That would be something to consider later when we may consider some off grid camps.
So for now, just thinking of dropping in a similar Lithium as replacement.
From what I have read the Lithium battery may not become fully charged using the existing van electricals but have also read that Lithiums don’t mind delivering power when less than fully charged so may not be a problem.
Question. Has anyone actually dropped a Lithium in to replace an AGM in a caravan without altering the van electricals and what was the result?

I cheated and bought the Mutha of All SoGens, I can either run stuff off of it or plug the Van in to it and then power Items in the van,

 

[Jaros]

What was the name of the Sogen and how expensive?

 

[condor22]

Have not long ago bought a small pop top to help spend more time around the goldfields.
The AGM battery in the van seems to be on its last legs. As far as I can tell all the battery seems to do is run the led lights in the van.
For the immediate future we will just be staying at caravan parks with 240v supply so we don’t want to spend a heap on upgraded van electricals. That would be something to consider later when we may consider some off grid camps.
So for now, just thinking of dropping in a similar Lithium as replacement.
From what I have read the Lithium battery may not become fully charged using the existing van electricals but have also read that Lithiums don’t mind delivering power when less than fully charged so may not be a problem.
Question. Has anyone actually dropped a Lithium in to replace an AGM in a caravan without altering the van electricals and what was the result?

Yes you can charge a lithium from an AGM charger. However, the charging algorithm (voltages and current) delivery are different. My lithiums are rated at 14.4VDC bulk charge max voltage and the Redarcs I have that are AGM chargers output up to 14.5VDC and some chargers at 14.6VDC. From my experience, this can affect the life span of a lithium.

My advice is; If you are going to invest in lithium, which aint cheap, invest in the correct charger for your battery, I say this as there are also variations in rated charge voltages amongst the many LiFePo4 batteries sold.

Also, an AGM goes through several phases of charging, nominally Bulk, Absorption and Float. Most Li batteries only have 2 stages - Bulk and float. Plus you do NOT want to use a charger that uses a desulphation mode on a Li battery. My charger is a 30 amp and recently I noted up to 29 amps going in, until the battery reaches 95% full, then the battery's internal battery management system rapidly slows this rate until they are full.

And finally - An AGM typically charges at between 10 & 20% of C i.e. a 100Ah @ 10 to 20 amps. Li batteries vary, mine are at 50% C or up to 50 amps. Read the data as I have 2 x 100Ah Li in parallel to give me 200Ah, but this does not mean I can charge at 100 amps. The data sheet states to retain the 50 amp max charge regardless of bank size.

(PS 'C' noted above is battery Capacity i.e. 100Ah)

 

[condor22]

Another factor worth noting - My 240VAC PM300 charger has a "soft start" mode when set to lithium profile. This means that it uses a lower voltage and current (amps) when turned on. This allows it to, for want of a better explanation, "Talk" to the battery BMS, assess what charge is needed, before cranking up the charger. This is far kinder to a Li battery re maximising life span.

 

[Ridge Runner]

What was the name of the Sogen and how expensive?

I bought the 1800Wh version of this EB240 / 2400Wh which is about equal to 2x 100Ah Lithium batteries, the beauty of these is there is no wiring and no messing with the vehicles electronics and the MPPT and all the important stuff is built in, Also not stated in the Video is they also sell 400 / 500w chargers for them so you can fully charge them from flat in around 4 hours and then they shut down so no chance of over charging etc, In Oz they sell a 1500wh version and the 2400wh version,

 

[condor22]

Aah, but where to put it. My van is 15' long and it won't fit under bed. Are there any mounting holes to fasten it down? Haven't measured bed base height, but little to no vent space left under there even if it did fit with a squeeze. In Oz there is a package of the Bluetti 2400W power bank, 2 x 350W panels @ around $5,500. I got 2 x 100AH Pylontechs and 2 x 150W Hardkorr panels for around $2,800. If I was running a large inverter or induction cooktop, it would certainly run them, but I don't lol.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Aah, but where to put it. My van is 15' long and it won't fit under bed. Are there any mounting holes to fasten it down? Haven't measured bed base height, but little to no vent space left under there even if it did fit with a squeeze. In Oz there is a package of the Bluetti 2400W power bank, 2 x 350W panels @ around $5,500. I got 2 x 100AH Pylontechs and 2 x 150W Hardkorr panels for around $2,800. If I was running a large inverter or induction cooktop, it would certainly run them, but I don't lol.

I can buy 2x 340w panels for $760 and the 2400wh SoGen for $1824.34 making a total of $2584.34, And the upside is I can take it from the vehicle to indoors when the power is out or in a Tent or down the shed or On a Boat, because it is 100% portable, It will fully charge in 4 hours from flat, So they both have their merrits,

The main reason for using portable power as I have said in the past is there is no messing with the Vehicles electrics and at the time my vehicle was still under warranty and I did not want to void the warranty which has worked out well along with having all the electronics all in one package with nothing else to buy or have to pay to get it wired in,

So with all the above I just prefer the option of being able to take the power where ever I want to go beit indoors or to vehicle to vehicle or where ever, And there are versions which is expandable up to 30Kwh, 1800wh is a lot of power and when hooked up with a couple of big panels the options are limitless.

 

[condor22]

I get my new 4by on Wed. Had the dealer wire up 2 Andersons on the rear bumper - 1 for van charging, the other for the van anti sway. Plus a 3rd on internal to the rear for future Aux battery. Given they did the work, shouldn't be an issue re warranty. all powered thru a solenoid, so when engine off, no power to any, protecting the start battery.

 

[Simmo]

I've got the same dual solenoid set-up in our Nissan, Mike.
I've always been wary of it as if you do flatten the aux battery by not paying attention, when you turn on your ignition, you dump the flat battery right across the crank battery??
I suppose, conversely, if you leave your lights on and flatten the crank battery, turning on the ignition should fire the solenoid and put the charged aux battery across your start battery?

 

[Pro-oz]

I've got the same dual solenoid set-up in our Nissan, Mike.
I've always been wary of it as if you do flatten the aux battery by not paying attention, when you turn on your ignition, you dump the flat battery right across the crank battery??
I suppose, conversely, if you leave your lights on and flatten the crank battery, turning on the ignition should fire the solenoid and put the charged aux battery across your start battery?

That's not how mine works Simmo, My solenoid doesn't turn on with ignition, turns on joining the start battery to aux battery when start battery reaches 13.7 volts ( from memory) Looking after the start battery first. In other words a smart solenoid.

Cheers

 

[Simmo]

Yeah Pete, I know that they are available. I think Redarc make one.
My set up is a dumb one, it was in the car when we bought it.

 

[Nightjar]

I've got the same dual solenoid set-up in our Nissan, Mike.
I've always been wary of it as if you do flatten the aux battery by not paying attention, when you turn on your ignition, you dump the flat battery right across the crank battery??
I suppose, conversely, if you leave your lights on and flatten the crank battery, turning on the ignition should fire the solenoid and put the charged aux battery across your start battery?

Simmo,
Been a many years since I set this system up in my MQ and then 2002 GU Nissan that has preformed faultlessly, please go easy on me if there are a few glitches in explanation.
1: Ignition/Engine on and both batteries charging.
2: Engine/ignition off, starting battery isolated from auxiliary battery and fridge battery with a solenoid.
3: In the event of flattening starting battery can flick switch to the solenoid powered by the auxiliary battery connecting auxiliary to starting battery.
4: Auxiliary battery and fridge battery are isolated with a separate solenoid, once again there is a switch so they can be connected when ever necessary.
5: 200W solar also charges fridge battery
6: Heavy cable runs from auxiliary battery to caravan batteries connected at hitch with Anderson plugs. Cable is fused both ends. Ute alternator charges while mobile.
7: Caravan has solar power to batteries. Batteries can be charged, 12V, Solar & 240V.

Foods cold/frozen and beers chilled. Happy prospectors.

 

[condor22]

My 6 yr old 4by (for the next 24hours lol) has auto lights off. i.e. if I leave them on, shut the door and lock it, a few seconds later the lights turn off. The new one has auto sensing headlights and wipers, they turn on when it gets dark enough and wet enough lol.

I know that most DC-DC chargers have voltage sensing disconnects, but I don't trust them enough to use that feature.

As I often travel alone, the best thing I got hold of was a Lithium Jump Starter, as I realised long ago that jumper leads are only useful when there is another vehicle nearby.

 

[Ridge Runner]

My 6 yr old 4by (for the next 24hours lol) has auto lights off. i.e. if I leave them on, shut the door and lock it, a few seconds later the lights turn off. The new one has auto sensing headlights and wipers, they turn on when it gets dark enough and wet enough lol.

I know that most DC-DC chargers have voltage sensing disconnects, but I don't trust them enough to use that feature.

As I often travel alone, the best thing I got hold of was a Lithium Jump Starter, as I realised long ago that jumper leads are only useful when there is another vehicle nearby.

The Auto Sensing is really a good feature, The Auto Braking is kind of unexpected but clever and the Auto Stop/Start is one that catches you out until you get use to it,

I carry the big Noco GB150 Lithium Booster in the Van all the time, There is not much it won't start, they are so powerful and leave jump leads for dead even with another vehicle close to hand,