12 volt fridge on a solar setup

[Ridge Runner]

Tests, current draw battery capacity is all well. Most important item IMHO, is a quality controller for solar panels such as a Victron. Quality controller along with moving panels thru out the day will give max return for daylight hours. Many controllers supplied with panels can be brought for about $4.50 on Amazon and not even MPPT as claimed. :awful:

Most of us use Victron MPPT or similar controllers, The importance of Lithium boils down to the it's willingness to except a Charge and not waste the power of Daylight, So Condors testing mirrored what I was finding using Lithium Packs / Solar Generators,

But most importantly by going Lithium we can shead a 100kgs or more keeping out Vehicle below GVM as well as allowing us to carry other gear if needed and Saving Space, Where a single 200Ah Lithium will take up the space of a 115Ah Group 31 Battery FLA,

It's hard not to be impressed with a Good Lithium Setup.

 

[user 22230]

Tests, current draw battery capacity is all well. Most important item IMHO, is a quality controller for solar panels such as a Victron. Quality controller along with moving panels thru out the day will give max return for daylight hours. Many controllers supplied with panels can be brought for about $4.50 on Amazon and not even MPPT as claimed. :awful:

Most of us use Victron MPPT or similar controllers, The importance of Lithium boils down to the it's willingness to except a Charge and not waste the power of Daylight, So Condors testing mirrored what I was finding using Lithium Packs / Solar Generators,

But most importantly by going Lithium we can shead a 100kgs or more keeping out Vehicle below GVM as well as allowing us to carry other gear if needed and Saving Space, Where a single 200Ah Lithium will take up the space of a 115Ah Group 31 Battery FLA,

It's hard not to be impressed with a Good Lithium Setup.

Correct but OP is looking at a set up for a bush block so cost for lithium for a weight gain not really relevant in this case :Y: Good to hear Victron is most peoples go to controller as noted controllers hadn't been mentioned?
:Y: :Y:

 

[condor22]

Re Victron - My old van had a 15A Victron for the 200W of panels. It was originally set to an AGM profile, which had to be done via plugin to a laptop as it wasn't Bluetooth.

When I changed over to the Lithium battery, my mate (supplier of the Battery and controller) reprogrammed the charge and float voltages of the Victron to a better lithium profile.

Yes, weight isn't a factor for static installs, but if AGM, then more capacity is needed. I can safely draw up to 80% from my lithium 13 kg 100AH. To get the same output and give a reasonable cycle life, I'd need 200AH of AGM at around 60+kg.

Given that a good quality AGM is around $400 = $800 for 2. For less than $200 more I got my Pylontech and more than double the cycle life of AGM.

Larger initial outlay, but starts to look more economical in the long run....

 

[Ridge Runner]

Tests, current draw battery capacity is all well. Most important item IMHO, is a quality controller for solar panels such as a Victron. Quality controller along with moving panels thru out the day will give max return for daylight hours. Many controllers supplied with panels can be brought for about $4.50 on Amazon and not even MPPT as claimed. :awful:

Most of us use Victron MPPT or similar controllers, The importance of Lithium boils down to the it's willingness to except a Charge and not waste the power of Daylight, So Condors testing mirrored what I was finding using Lithium Packs / Solar Generators,

But most importantly by going Lithium we can shead a 100kgs or more keeping out Vehicle below GVM as well as allowing us to carry other gear if needed and Saving Space, Where a single 200Ah Lithium will take up the space of a 115Ah Group 31 Battery FLA,

It's hard not to be impressed with a Good Lithium Setup.

Correct but OP is looking at a set up for a bush block so cost for lithium for a weight gain not really relevant in this case :Y: Good to hear Victron is most peoples go to controller as noted controllers hadn't been mentioned?
:Y: :Y:

A cheap 40Ah Lithium battery would do what the OP wants because of their willingness to except a Charge and a portable 40Ah pack would do it all because the charge controller is built in.

Like most of us here we have all searched for the perfect Battery setup, I started buying 115Ah Deep cycle batteries and the AGM's and about 2+ years ago I moved to Portable Lithium Packs, 26/11/2019.

Earlier this year Condor bought a great 40Ah+/- portable Lithium pack and it sort of changed his views on camping power Now there is just no contolling the Lad, layful:

I think I've Created a Monster, ] ] ]

 

[condor22]

The primary reason I took so long to go Lithium was financial, lol.

BTW This "Lad" is 70+, so I'll take the compliment.

PS RR You're NOT puttin your slippers under my bed, lol....

 

[Ridge Runner]

The primary reason I took so long to go Lithium was financial, lol.

BTW This "Lad" is 70+, so I'll take the compliment.

PS RR You're NOT puttin your slippers under my bed, lol....

Yeah the money is the killer, Mine cost me 1191 for the two now they are charging 850 each for them, Since the currant events every thing has gone through the roof, Funny though Proper Lithium Batteries have come down to around 600 or less on average,

I won't see 21 again myself.

It's cold here and I'm wearing Snow Boots alot lately, :inlove:

 

[condor22]

Started the -15 test last night, same parameters etc.

Currently at the 14 hour mark and AH used = 22.6. This is 1.61 AH per hour average which should be approx 38.7 AH for a full 24 hours. See how my math is later at the 24 hour mark lol.

Battery is still holding above 13 V.

The real test will be next April/May when I go prospecting, the fridge will; Have food n drink in it, be in the car with solar and DC-DC charging and occasionally opened.

This does prove one thing, a 40AH Lithium portable will be flat powering a 40lt combi at -15C unless it is simultaneously getting a charge.

RR If it's that cold, what dya need a fridge for? lol

 

[condor22]

Finished the -15 test and the results were fairly predictable, lol. The AH were very close to what I calculated, so at least some consistency. Temp of the freezer was again no higher than set temp and near 3 C colder. Ambient was reasonably similar to previous tests as well.

As I mentioned in the previous post, I would not want to run the Combi from a 40AH Lithium power pack for a full day without some kind of charging. I'd be more than happy to run from my 100AH Lithium for up to a day without a charge.

As I rarely, if ever, don't charge from solar, DC-DC or mains 240, not a big issue. Super impressed that, at the lowest I would set the freezer, the battery volts were still above 13.0V. Kind of negates the low battery setting cutout of the fridge.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Started the -15 test last night, same parameters etc.

Currently at the 14 hour mark and AH used = 22.6. This is 1.61 AH per hour average which should be approx 38.7 AH for a full 24 hours. See how my math is later at the 24 hour mark lol.

Battery is still holding above 13 V.

The real test will be next April/May when I go prospecting, the fridge will; Have food n drink in it, be in the car with solar and DC-DC charging and occasionally opened.

This does prove one thing, a 40AH Lithium portable will be flat powering a 40lt combi at -15C unless it is simultaneously getting a charge.

RR If it's that cold, what dya need a fridge for? lol

At around the same Temps as yours I can run the 47L for 24hrs and running the 78L @ -18*c I would need 120% of the 40Ah which is about 48Ah @ around 25*c, Using a 40Ah pack It can work as long as the Solar charges the 40Ah at first light then it only has to power the fridge during the Dark hours, or If I run 2 of them so while one is charging the other is being used.

I am thinking of buying the PowerOak / Bluetti 1500Ah which will give me about 3X the power,

The bare minimum a person needs to run a fridge without too many problems is around 1000Wh over a 24hr period with still a bit in reserve, erfect:

They say -3* down to -12*c in Scotland on the 24th Dec. and 6 days of Snow :inlove: :inlove: :inlove:

 

[condor22]

Got the Combi set to -10 on 240 VAC, not for the freezer as that side is empty. But put some Xmas beers in the fridge side plus a temp gauge.

Last 3 days the fridge has been running at between 0.3C and 1.6C.

Great chilled beer in this hot weather.

In consideration of RR in Pomland, might I suggest a Travel Buddy Oven for your beer, lol.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Got the Combi set to -10 on 240 VAC, not for the freezer as that side is empty. But put some Xmas beers in the fridge side plus a temp gauge.

Last 3 days the fridge has been running at between 0.3C and 1.6C.

Great chilled beer in this hot weather.

In consideration of RR in Pomland, might I suggest a Travel Buddy Oven for your beer, lol.

Bugga, LOLOLOLOL :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

This damn place should be called Engel Land not England layful: layful: layful: :lol: :lol: Bloody freezing.

A packet of CC/Corn chips and a freshly Micro waved Beer is becoming the New Norm :argh: :argh: :argh: 8.( 8.( 8.( 8.( 8.(

 

[condor22]

Merry Xmas mate, stay warm, but not as warm as ya beer.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Merry Xmas mate, stay warm, but not as warm as ya beer.

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you to mate and enjoy all your new Toys soon to arrive,

Gimme a Sec Just gotta put another Beer on the Stove layful: layful:

 

[condor22]

I've had the Engel Combi on in the spare room over the last week via mains 240 VAC. Primarily to chill the Xmas "lemonade".

I set the fridge to -2C and empty in the freezer compartment. The fridge section has 1/2 beers and 1/2 cokes plus some choccy and flavoured milk in it.

I have an Engel wireless thermometer in the fridge section, which over the last week has maintained a temp range of 1.6 to 1.8 C. It's in a non airconditioned room which is currently at 24 C (even tho 33 outside). Room ambient has ranged from 20 C to 29 C over the last week, yesterday was a 40 C day outside.

Really happy with the 0.2 C consistency of the fridge temperature, even when opened for a short time for me to indulge once or twice a day....

I've had the 15 lt Brass Monkey in similar circumstances and recorded a 5 C difference in max/min fridge temp. (Set to 2 C and ranged from 0 to 5)

 

[Jaros]

I have the Engel set to 2-3 degrees because the temp guage on the Engel died a few years so i just check it occasionally with a digital thermometer. The Brass monkey has been tried a few times and cools very well.

 

[condor22]

Thing I didn't quite realise when I bought the combi is that when used as a combi with the divider, the temp gauge is what the freezer is set to. The divider panel insulates the fridge compartment from the sub zero temps and a fan operates to keep the fridge compartment cold but not frozen.

I did manage to do a quick temp reading of the fridge when I did the -5 & -10 freezer tests and it hovered between zero and 2 C (Engel was empty in those tests).

I guess the proof will be when I get it into the 4by and do my next trip. Only around 113 days to go, Covid notwithstanding, but not counting, lol.

 

[user 22230]

Engel Combi obviously works the same as Waeco Dual Zone models . Same same with divider in :Y: On long trips Waeco 80 used as freezer and short trips when not so much food required, used as fridge freezer. A 35 litre is always in vehicle run 24/7 in any case as a drink - dairy fridge, that just being because the climate here dictates it

 

[condor22]

As this refers to solar, "Buyer Beware"

I'm looking at adding solar to my new van, did a search on Ebay and found this https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/294289721061?hash=item448508c6e5:g:N88AAOSwimphOs-1&frcectupt=true

Key points on this item - It states it is a 250 W flexible panel. I was unable to find any stated amps output in the details. I did find its physical size 1080 x 710.
Here are some statistics to help explain

1. The power of the Sun at the Earth, per square metre is called the solar constant and is approximately 1370 watts per square metre (W/m2).
2. How much energy does 1 square meter of solar panel produce? - The standard solar panel has an input rate of around 1000 Watts/square meter, and the majority of solar panels available have around 15-20% efficiency. Therefore, 1 square meter would likely only produce around 150W in good sunlight. This is Maximum output

The above flexible panel is 0.77 square metres. Using the value in 2. the expected output would be no more than 115 W or between 5-6 amps max. I have a 110 W panel on my 4x4 roof, which is of a similar physical size and does output 5-6 amps.

Conclusion - In my opinion the advertised panel at the advertised physical size is either not 250 W or it is running at close to 200% efficiency.

Warranty explained ...........

 

[condor22]

Warranty - Some panels have a warranty specification annotated as 5/25, 10/25 or 5 etc. What does this mean?

Answer; In terms of a single figure, it is a product warranty of years on the product, may have more detail as to what the warranty is, re manufacture or output.

In terms of */** - This is usually - The first value is the manufacture or physical attribute warranty in years. In other words if it falls apart or has a physical fault.
The second figure is the warranty of solar output in years. Or, i.e. 100 W guaranteed for * years.

However, you need to look at the fine print - I've seen some panels @ 10/25 warranty, but the fine print explains "up to 90% output at 20 years and 80% at 25 years or similar. Why, solar panel output deteriorates over time.

Good quality glass panels have the 10/25 warranty, I've seen the exceptional odd panel at 25/25.
Medium quality would be 5/25.

There are some glass panels with just 5 years warranty, I would not use them. I won't state Supplier or Manufacturer, but they are known brands.

I've not seen any flexible panels with more than 5 years.

More........

 

[condor22]

Flexible panels -

I had 2 x 100W on my old van. They worked well for the first 5 years, but the output was dropping off in the last year or so. They were 7 years old.

I did some research on their construction -

There is a transparent film on the upper surface, it is in layers and deteriorates in UV (sunlight). The panels I used, had 6 layers and I noticed after around 18 months old the surface was mottled, rough and the film was "flaking off". I asked the supplier/designer why? This is how I know the above. Once that layer has "disappeared" The surface is similar to new. How quick this happens is dependent upon environment i.e. under cover when not in use, how much weather exposed to...... Once all layers have "gone" stand buy to replace.

Bottom line - The life span of a flexible panel is far less than a glass panel. A 100 W flexible is around 15-20% of the weight and 2-3mm thick compared to 30mm for a glass panel.

Conclusion - If you want to save weight/space then you compromise on life of use.