Victorian Government Response to Victorian Environmental Assessment Councils (VEAC) Investigation into additional prospecting areas in parks

[RottenRon]

Beware, these areas have not yet been opened up.

1 Yankee Creek, Lerderderg State Park
2 Morning Star, Lerderderg State Park
3 Jerusalem Creek, Lake Eildon National Park
4 Howqua Hills South, Alpine National Park
5 Howqua Hills East, Alpine National Park
6 Howittville, Alpine National Park
7 Wombat PO, Alpine National Park
8 Eustaces, Alpine National Par

It could be another 7 or 8 mths or more yet. All that has happened so far is the is a report has been handed to the Vic Gov. entitled;-

Victorian Government Response to
Victorian Environmental Assessment Councils
Report on the
Investigation into additional
prospecting areas in parks
February 2014

Read it for yourself at http://www.veac.vic.gov.au/document...o-VEAC-Prospecting-Investigation-Feb-2014.pdf

Pay particular attention to the restrictions and conditions on page 4. In particular, "non mechanical hand tools" (no yabby pumps) and "sluices and motorised equipment must not be used for processing excavated material" REMEMBER, THIS IS A RECOMMENDATION AT THIS STAGE. IT HAS NOT BEEN PASSED, NOR HAVE THE NEW AREAS BEEN OPENED UP AS YET.

I'm waiting on a phone call to get some more details which I will post shortly.

There's also an old article in the Age, part of which I will quote here;
The Age June 7, 2013
The environment council said it had seen clear evidence of damage from prospecting, such as unfilled holes and collapsed stream banks, and noted the concerns of Melbourne Water that prospecting could undermine efforts to improve river health.
Council chairman and former state Liberal minister Phil Honeywood said while prospecting could have a low impact, it was clear it can damage natural and cultural heritage values.
He said prospecting did not "sit well with the purpose of national and state parks".

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/g...-parks-pass-20130607-2nv9c.html#ixzz2t5wIfG30

The main thing to be gleaned from this is the importance of cleaning up your holes. Doesn't matter if you been detecting, sluicing, panning, scratchin flaming cracks, FILL THE BASTARDS IN. If you don't you run the risk of further alienating the non prospecting public, with the inevitable result, we'll be shut out, or at the very least, further restricted. As a whole, we are skating on thin ice.

If you see someone who leaves a hole open, and doesn't clean up a, don't hesitate to guilt trip them, or they'll stuff it up for everyone. Protect your pastime and investment (in equipment). If they make a habit of it, don't stuff about, if they belong to the forum, name and shame them.

I too thought these areas had been opened up, so I researched all this during the week, after having had a look over one area last weekend. Now that I know what the deal is, I will be PMing the guy that left the dirty great hole around the stump in the creek bed on Sunday. No names, no packdrill at this stage.

Remember, research, ask questions of the right people, verify info with the appropriate Gov. dept. and clean up after yourself.
Excuses like, "I didn't realize", didn't know, or "I thought", just wont cut it soon.

Cheers, Ron.

 

[Goldpick]

You guys should think yourself lucky that you can even access national parks, in SA, we cannot even access state forest areas other than the overworked designated fossicking areas. I'm really surprised they even considered allowing prospecting in national parks. All the same, pollies will be quick to ban anything if it will make them look good to the masses.

 

[RottenRon]

You guys should think yourself lucky that you can even access national parks, in SA, we cannot even access state forest areas other than the overworked designated fossicking areas. I'm really surprised they even considered allowing prospecting in national parks. All the same, pollies will be quick to ban anything if it will make them look good to the masses.

You're right of course. We are lucky, and so will any interstater when they come over this way to have a sniff around. Remember, these new areas, when opened up, plus all the existing ones, are available to everyone with the right permits. At least, if we all do the right thing, fill holes, take out our rubbish etc, it might stay that way for a while.
There's another thing worth thinking about. It's everyone's responsibility to do the right thing. I dare say, if South Auzzie prospectors want any chance to expand available areas, where do you think the S.A. Gov etc will look to do their research. I'm pretty sure they'll also look to our (Vic.) example to help make their recommendations.
Just a thought.
Cheers, Ron.

 

[EternalChase]

Fellow Prospectors,

As a member of the PMAV I cannot REAFFIRM strong enough what Ron is reporting and warning ALL prospectors. The Association spends a significant amount of time supporting the fight for additional areas to be opened up for us.

I spend a bit of time out in the field with Ron, and we both have the utmost respect for the territories we enter and take care leaving the areas as we found them. It is unfortunate that we come across detecting holes that remain unfilled, as well as see high banking in rivers where large holes are not back filled. Tall piles of discarded rock and muddy puddles where they originated will only fuel Govt. Departments to decline any recommendations put forward to open new areas. It will also load the barrels of green inclined groups and Govt. Officials alike to further restrict the types of equipment we are allowed to use.

PLEASE ENSURE YOU HAVE APPROPRIATE ACCESS RIGHTS TO CREEKS, RIVERS AND LAND AREAS BEFORE YOU DO SO.

PLEASE BACK FILL HOLES AND ENSURE THE AREA IS IN AS CLOSE TO ORIGINAL APPEARANCE AS WHEN YOU FOUND IT.

Let's try and work with these agencies, to enable our hobby to live on and give prospectors a respectable name and good reputation in the wider community. It's an important part of our Australian history, and would be nice to pass on to generations to follow.

Stay informed, stay alert, stay safe out there and leave some gold for the rest of us to find

Mark

 

[Goldpick]

You guys should think yourself lucky that you can even access national parks, in SA, we cannot even access state forest areas other than the overworked designated fossicking areas. I'm really surprised they even considered allowing prospecting in national parks. All the same, pollies will be quick to ban anything if it will make them look good to the masses.

You're right of course. We are lucky, and so will any interstater when they come over this way to have a sniff around. Remember, these new areas, when opened up, plus all the existing ones, are available to everyone with the right permits. At least, if we all do the right thing, fill holes, take out our rubbish etc, it might stay that way for a while.
There's another thing worth thinking about. It's everyone's responsibility to do the right thing. I dare say, if South Auzzie prospectors want any chance to expand available areas, where do you think the S.A. Gov etc will look to do their research. I'm pretty sure they'll also look to our (Vic.) example to help make their recommendations.
Just a thought.
Cheers, Ron.

Nah, the SA govt don't look to Vic for the correct way to manage things ( I really wish they would), as far as they are concerned, it's far easier to manage if they just lock areas up and throw away the key - less cost and less hassles for them, unfortunately for us. Detecting is fast becoming an underground and covert hobby, especially considering any old relics, coins or significant finds are meant to be returned to the ground, or reported to the relevant authorities.

 

[G0lddigg@]

Lads I can see your both really passionate about the subject and that's comforting but putting your own observations about damage caused by other prospectors in an open forum.... do you think this is helping the cause?

I'm sure your referring to the confusion over maps like this one, both maps come from the same document, however heritage river clearly marked on the second map but the first one looks like it falls under "state forest and other public land available for prospecting" being marked with green lines and not black as is the legend.

 

[dwt]

this is a serious issue, and its sounding like its beginng to get to the stage that our rite to vote needs to come in to play....have a chat with your local MP,punishing the majority for the mistakes of a few only seems to happen when the word "prospector" gets passed around ....plenty of motorcycle enduro/motocross, 4x4ing and other activites happen in the bush at any given time(which can be classed as having an enviromental impact) and seem to be able to continue each year (i know im one these participants) no one seems to mind when i (attempt) to power slide around corners in the forests on a registerd dirtbike so i really struggle to see the problem with being registerd digging a hole,removing the item,and filling my hole in and moving on with my,plenty of people dont fill in there holes and plenty of people dont stick to a designated track or route when there out riding or driving...prospectors seem to be at the blunt end of the "dont touch the bush" speel quite a lot, get onto your local MP, you put them there, get them working for YOUR hard earned tax dollars.
.................dwt........... 8)

 

[RottenRon]

Hi G0lddigg@.
Point taken about the "open forum", but that's where the majority of prospectors get their info from. If a point needs to be made to prospectors in general, then it could be argued as best and most responsible thing to do, as apposed to saying nothing for fear our detractors get some ammo. I'm not sorry I've said my piece, and thought I chose my words fairly well, considering what I really wanted to say. Please also note, I never made any reference to which of the 8 new area recommendations I was referring to.

I suspect the point you make about the "Green" lines in map 1 to be incorrect. If they were green, why then is there not the corresponding green line symbol in the legend? I realize map 2 seems to be a lot clearer as they are very obviously black, but I also think variations in the maps colour may account for that.

Having said that though, that raises the issue that these maps are still "recommendations" and therefore those areas indicated, may not yet be Heritage. So one could easily assume those areas to be state forest (light Green) and therefore available to prospect.
What a can of worms.

So everyone knows, for the record. I Pm'd the guy I spoke about in my earlier post and it appears I may have jumped the gun a bit. This guy apparently only made an existing hole he found a bit deeper. His advise to me was that he attempted to fill it in with what was available. I did apologize to him, stating I just had a bee in my bonnet about media comments and the possible outcomes of the recommendations. The fact remains however, the hole that remained was still a mess. I don't know about anyone else, but I've just spent a motza on my hi-banker, sluices and pump. I'd really hate to have to put it all away, never mind the potential loss of a great hobby.

My point still remains however, keep cleaning up after yourselves people.

Cheers,Ron.
PS, Wouldn't it be great if the Vic. Government was to publish detailed maps of all the allowable prospecting areas. I'd have no problem buying them if they were accurate and easy to read.
One could argue that if the Gov were to attempt prosecute/penalize someone for being in the wrong area, the fact that they haven't made a fair and reasonable attempt to provide decent information, would see those charges thrown out.

 

[G0lddigg@]

your a passionate bloke Ron and there's no reason to apologize for that nor for saying your piece. I do know that you need to chose your words very careful on the internet because one minute your making a point and the next its being held against you the internet is forever. ....

Keep up the good work mate

 

[EternalChase]

Ron, I agree with your comment regarding maps being available to specify exactly where we can and cannot go. There are certainly road rules and regulations that are explicit enough for us to know when we are breaking the law whilst driving for example.

I cannot blame anyone for being in an area that unbeknown to them was otherwise restricted, without proper written/mapped warning.

 

[RottenRon]

Hey Mark. New Picture if see. Sign of things to come I hope,,,lol
Cheers,

 

[Village]

So where to from here? Should we not establish a fighting fund and commission our own report before this gets royal ascent?

 

[EternalChase]

Ron, that's what I plan to do with all of the gold I find, smelt it down using ingots to create great shiny bars of gold HAHA.......

Village has a great idea, but ultimately that is what the PMAV is for - join up and pay your membership (donate a little extra in fact as I have done) and this will/can be used for such joint ventures into tackling our own responses to such proposals. Spread the word and get as many members to join, they really are a valuable bunch of people.

Mark

 

[Goldtarget]

Same old story. I commented on a previous past about this, but in light of this being a new thread I'll say it again. It doesn't matter what the activity, trail bikes, camping,fishing, shooting, hunting, 4x4, woodcutting, or prospecting, wherever there is some recreational user they will just try to further impede it. My short years on this earth have been witness to every single activity bear the brunt of further restriction and i feel not only dead lucky to have had a chance to do all these things, i feel for the next generations who wont. The idea is to lock it up, and those community members who want things stopped don't play by the rules they will use any and all methods, tricks and dirty underhanded means to shut us out. That said everytime this sort of thing comes up i write to the minister, local member, and join an association to protest. I invite any interested party to do the same. I hope a collective effort can be formed and heard and the powers that be take notice. If you have a petition, day or days of organised activity to help stop any future changes please advise, count me in. It will take numbers they can't simply ignore to make a difference. I sure do hope we have them active and willing, because its getting beyond a joke. Short of saving our existing rights, we will all be chipping in for a lease. Just a thought.

 

[EternalChase]

Same old story. I commented on a previous past about this, but in light of this being a new thread I'll say it again. It doesn't matter what the activity, trail bikes, camping,fishing, shooting, hunting, 4x4, woodcutting, or prospecting, wherever there is some recreational user they will just try to further impede it. My short years on this earth have been witness to every single activity bear the brunt of further restriction and i feel not only dead lucky to have had a chance to do all these things, i feel for the next generations who wont. The idea is to lock it up, and those community members who want things stopped don't play by the rules they will use any and all methods, tricks and dirty underhanded means to shut us out. That said everytime this sort of thing comes up i write to the minister, local member, and join an association to protest. I invite any interested party to do the same. I hope a collective effort can be formed and heard and the powers that be take notice. If you have a petition, day or days of organised activity to help stop any future changes please advise, count me in. It will take numbers they can't simply ignore to make a difference. I sure do hope we have them active and willing, because its getting beyond a joke.

* touch

 

[RottenRon]

Hi guys.
All points duly noted.

I agree with Mark. Join PMAV. I haven't yet, but will be soon. I see no reason to waste the good work they have done thus far. No point in re-inventing the wheel.

I'm starting to think a rally of some sort might be a reasonable idea. It would take some organizing. I'm not talking about some half baked protest march, but a something that get's the message across, that this is a great family hobby and past time. Rewarding in more ways than one.

It would take a committee of some sort to strategise and plan. A fund to cover some limited advertising so that the general public know what we are about and aimed at encouraging support for everyone's right to continue our forebear's historic pursuits.
I'm not suggesting we want to take over all the parks and forests, just maintain those areas we have available and proposed now. Keep limited use of sluices and hi-bankers as well as panning and detectors.

Given enough time and reasonable planning, it may even be possible to encourage interstate prospectors to join in the rally.
All of this will be pointless or course, if we can't encourage fellow prospectors to,,, you guessed it,, clean up after ourselves.

Look, it's just an idea, but I would be interested to hear from forum members, and others that might consider something like this.

Cheers, Ron.

 

[Goldtarget]

The new anti association laws in qld have been addressed in some low budget high impact social media campaigns that sort to swell the ranks that led to some great turnouts in public. In the age we live in i suspect that shouldn't be so hard for concerned members here aswell. I apologise for straying into political territory i its generally something I'd avoid, but with a short lead up time (and we ought be thankful we have had warning) the sooner action is taken the more effective the end result. An online petition could also cutout alot of the physical legwork normally associated with such things.getting interstate members on board shouldn't be to difficult, but any approach on a national level should be directed in a national way. Submitting to the federal level may give a little more leverage. I believe any suggestion is a good one, once your rights are lost they won't come back. Standing up and being counted won't ensure a victory, but passively letting the restrictions come to play will ensure a defeat. And thanks Ron for reminding us of our general responsibilities and for this thread.

 

[EternalChase]

For any new comers to this topic, or any newbie prospector that has not read a great deal on their responsibilities as a prospector I encourage you to read:

http://www.energyandresources.vic.g...-prospecting-and-fossicking/prospecting-guide

paying particular attention to:

 

[G0lddigg@]

Hi guys.
All points duly noted.

I agree with Mark. Join PMAV. I haven't yet, but will be soon. I see no reason to waste the good work they have done thus far. No point in re-inventing the wheel.

I'm starting to think a rally of some sort might be a reasonable idea. It would take some organizing. I'm not talking about some half baked protest march, but a something that get's the message across, that this is a great family hobby and past time. Rewarding in more ways than one.

It would take a committee of some sort to strategise and plan. A fund to cover some limited advertising so that the general public know what we are about and aimed at encouraging support for everyone's right to continue our forebear's historic pursuits.
I'm not suggesting we want to take over all the parks and forests, just maintain those areas we have available and proposed now. Keep limited use of sluices and hi-bankers as well as panning and detectors.

Given enough time and reasonable planning, it may even be possible to encourage interstate prospectors to join in the rally.
All of this will be pointless or course, if we can't encourage fellow prospectors to,,, you guessed it,, clean up after ourselves.

Look, it's just an idea, but I would be interested to hear from forum members, and others that might consider something like this.

Cheers, Ron.

I agree if you want to contribute and do something Join PMAV "http://www.pmav.org.au/images/stories/membershipapp2014.pdf" they do a bloody good job, I cant see any benefit in organizing some new committee PMAV are and will continue to be engaged in protecting our interest. get involved with them and build on whats been developed over the past 34 years.

 

[RottenRon]

Hi guys.
All points duly noted.

I agree with Mark. Join PMAV. I haven't yet, but will be soon. I see no reason to waste the good work they have done thus far. No point in re-inventing the wheel.

I'm starting to think a rally of some sort might be a reasonable idea. It would take some organizing. I'm not talking about some half baked protest march, but a something that get's the message across, that this is a great family hobby and past time. Rewarding in more ways than one.

It would take a committee of some sort to strategise and plan. A fund to cover some limited advertising so that the general public know what we are about and aimed at encouraging support for everyone's right to continue our forebear's historic pursuits.
I'm not suggesting we want to take over all the parks and forests, just maintain those areas we have available and proposed now. Keep limited use of sluices and hi-bankers as well as panning and detectors.

Given enough time and reasonable planning, it may even be possible to encourage interstate prospectors to join in the rally.
All of this will be pointless or course, if we can't encourage fellow prospectors to,,, you guessed it,, clean up after ourselves.

Look, it's just an idea, but I would be interested to hear from forum members, and others that might consider something like this.

Cheers, Ron.

I agree if you want to contribute and do something Join PMAV "http://www.pmav.org.au/images/stories/membershipapp2014.pdf" they do a bloody good job, I cant see any benefit in organizing some new committee PMAV are and will continue to be engaged in protecting our interest. get involved with them and build on whats been developed over the past 34 years.

G'day mate.

I wasn't really suggesting a "new committee" as such, more like suggesting it would take a group of people, (within the PMAV as you suggest maybe) to do the ground work.

I'm also fully aware that even with my limited calls to the PMAV in the last week or so, they need all the support and help they can get. This idea I've raised is nothing more than an idea at this stage. Some discussion would need to take place to nut out the merits and pitfalls, then make an educated decision rather than a rash one.

Look, if this subject doesn't get enough interest from members, then the question has to be asked, is it worth the effort? Personally, I think it is. It will be too late when we get restricted that much, that we'll be lucky to have access to any viable creeks etc

By the way. All the rivers shown as Heritage on the "recommended" area maps, appear to come under the Heritage River Act 1992, Schedules 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, Unfortunately, the Act is as clear as mud, and reference has to be made to maps held in the Central Plan Office which is in the Department of Sustainability and Environment.

Bureaucracy certainly hasn't made it easy for us.

I'd be very pleased to hear other peoples thoughts on the subject, but please take the time to read all the posts thus far.