Selling gold - how, why, where

[Nightjar]

Have kept all my species, have never crushed any.
Arrived at a destination with rain tumbling down all night. Radio next morning warned of flooding in the area.
Had a quick swing before packing up tent then skedaddled out of there.
Skidded off the road in my then 2002/ 5 month old ute, fortunately got under way again without damage other than very muddy and dirty.

Found this, my favorite named the "Octopus". 308g specie with 53g/AU.
Will be very handy sale in the future if another type of "rainy day" sets in.

 

[OzzieAu]

Its sure got a grip on that quartz that golden occy.

 

[Daniel77]

Nightjar that's gorgeous, if I was lucky enough to find something like that I would not sell it, that's a keeper. :Y:

 

[saau]

What concerns me is what are the rules about selling my finds per state.

Most ppl. would know about the Gold shops in WA, but other state rules are really different.

I have been told by guys who brag about selling .au they found in XYZ state, when it is illegal to do that !!!

 

[user 4485]

What concerns me is what are the rules about selling my finds per state.

Most ppl. would know about the Gold shops in WA, but other state rules are really different.

I have been told by guys who brag about selling .au they found in XYZ state, when it is illegal to do that !!!

Pretty sure it's only South Australia that have that rule. I'm not 100% sure on Tasmania though.
Other states allow selling the "occasional lucky find" but, as it's a recreational activity, selling minerals as a business type venture that contributes substantially to your income could be considered commercial.
Queensland allow up to a $100,000 limit before royalties are due.

 

[user 4386]

I often wonder how many people actually sell the gold they find, other than as larger specimens (keeping the rest).

The reason I ask is that I see people throwing all their gold into single containers, regardless of where they get it. Given that native gold can vary from about 50% gold-silver alloy to 99.7% gold (the purest I have ever found, probably supergene), I don't see how a buyer could know what to pay if someone brought them one of these "mixed bags". Large pieces are easily analysed non-destructively. In Victoria gold is commomly around 92% gold unless supergene (then it is 97% or more) - but in the east of the state 75% is common. The goldfields gold buyers used to know the purity for the goldfields on which they were trading.

I just checked some figures for prices being paid for alluvial gold from some Victorian areas in the 1890s. Gold in central Victoria was fetching over 4 pounds per ounce in general, up to 4 pounds 7 shillings per ounce. In Omeo the range was 3 pounds 5 shillings to 3 pounds 12 shillings per ounce. So in some areas in the east alluvial miners were only getting 69% of the price per ounce that was typical of central Victoria.

 

[user 12139]

I agree with you Goldierocks, anyone buying gold, particularly species, who dont first refine is peeing in the wind. They're paying an attraction price.
Gold I've sold has gone to refiners who refine first then pay spot price. I've noticed over the years the darker in colour gold is, generally the higher grade it is. Today based on grade parameters, refiners think they know exactly the shires my gold comes from... but so far none have ever been on the money!
I dont doubt its possible to determine where its come from, but unless your mining and also refining, therefore lots of accurate data for the database I'm sceptical. A person who only refines.. nup, because their customers are like me, tight lipped and full of BS when it comes to location

 

[user 4386]

I agree with you Goldierocks, anyone buying gold, particularly species, who dont first refine is peeing in the wind.
Gold I've sold has gone to refiners who refine first then pay spot price. I've noticed over the years the darker in colour gold is, generally the higher grade it is. Today based on grade parameters, refiners think they know exactly the shires my gold comes from... but so far none have ever been on the money!
I dont doubt its possible to determine where its come from, but unless your mining and therefore lots of gold data for the database I'm sceptical. Mining companies who refine would be the most accurate, but a simple Jo Blow refiner, nup! His customers are like me... tight lipped!

GT Gold..
View attachment 1438

Yes, things like regular supply from what is obviously one locality gives buyers confidence - as it did when they were based on the specific goldfields where they were buying. It is people chucking everything into one container that surprises me - I can only think that they do not intend to sell. Can do it on the smelt but does not work for small quantities.

I just thought I would bring it to people's attention, in case they did not realise. A value like you show is what I commonly get for supergene gold (not only low silver but some trace copper). That is, secondary gold redposited in the weathering zone (e.g. lateritic). Whether it be Eastern Goldfields WA or the Ballarat district. The higher silver in eastern Victoria may be that the gold is being more rapidly eroded directly from the source veins into streams, with no period of millions of years weathering away in the soil - a function of higher topography and rainfall.

Your observation re colour is soundly based as a generalization - more silver content, the paler the gold.

Here is some historical data for Victorian goldfields. Note how low the value of St Arnaud north gold was, despite being in western Victoria (the main reff there started off as the St Arnaud Silver Mining Company until they got below the supergene zone - a different type of weathering history that enriched silver. This is a silver-rich area west of the Avoca Fault but east of Ararat (the Maryborough Mining District straddled the fault, so mostly included higher value gold from goldfields east of the fault.. You can also see the mostly low maximum values paid for gold from the Gippsland district, farther east in Victoria, particularly the Omeo subdivision that included silver-rich gold extending from Swifts Creek north up the Tallangatta valley to Bethanga and Granya. A similar silver-rich belt occurred east of that on the upper Dart River but these two belts rartely had gold returns reported as the production was too small.

 

[user 12139]

Its a great point you've raised Goldierocks and certainly something that not only amateur buyers, but sellers also need to be aware of..
bit like that Fine Cotton syndicate!

 

[user 4386]

It reminds me of miners in northern South Australia (Lambina area?) who found fine precious opals that could pass as black opals - so they would drive to Lightning Ridge to sell them as Lightning Ridge black opal! Mind you, they were just as good...

 

[Greg_wilson]

I sell most of my gold and usually charge (and get) spot price plus $5 to $10. On good looking or bigger nuggets usually more.

I sell nuggets, not bullion and not purity just nuggets.

 

[user 4386]

I sell most of my gold and usually charge (and get) spot price plus $5 to $10. On good looking or bigger nuggets usually more.

I sell nuggets, not bullion and not purity just nuggets.

Yes, nuggets are something different - only broadly related to gold price but having their own intrinsic value.

 

[Goldfield Joe]

I sell most of the gold I find, it is all from the GT. My Melbourne gold buyer melts it all down first which helps get rid of dirt and other impurities. Then they take a reading of the melted lump with an XRF machine. I can say I have never been disappointed by this method and the gold is usually in the 93 - 96 % pure range. So I guess with people who travel to multiple regions and find gold, throwing it all into the same container wouldn't matter if their gold buyer used this method too...

 

[Gold1hunter]

I think most of you are thinking too much.
Just stick it on Gumtree as Sparkling Australian nuggets all those sub Grammers put in half ounce or 1 ounce packs and sell the gold $50 below $DAY ounce price. No one asks about purity or where it comes from (& if they did there's other enquiries coming) they are just happy to be buying gold from the prospector. Usually have cash in hand in less than 24hrs of listing.
So if you want to send off to refineries or go to gold buyers and get $60 a gram after a whole lot of messing around - good luck with that, been there done that NEVER AGAIN!

 

[Hawkear]

Recently sold about half ounce in small nuggets on gumtree. I asked 90% of gold price on the day. Did not have any problems finding a buyer. The only concern I had was in doing a cash transaction as I was a bit concerned about giving my address out to someone I knew little about.
I resolved my concerns there by organizing to speak by phone thereby getting a traceable phone number and assurance that he was Bona fides.

 

[Gold1hunter]

Recently sold about half ounce in small nuggets on gumtree. I asked 90% of gold price on the day. Did not have any problems finding a buyer. The only concern I had was in doing a cash transaction as I was a bit concerned about giving my address out to someone I knew little about.
I resolved my concerns there by organizing to speak by phone thereby getting a traceable phone number and assurance that he was Bona fides.

$50 below ounce price works 10% is just giving it away for no reason. Try it next time.

 

[allcables]

hello all
one question for those that may want to answer, "selling gold" does the transaction find its way to the ATO
cheers all

 

[HarryHoudini]

hello all
one question for those that may want to answer, "selling gold" does the transaction find its way to the ATO
cheers all

We dont sell gold get with the program

 

[HippyProspecting]

hello all
one question for those that may want to answer, "selling gold" does the transaction find its way to the ATO
cheers all

Sound like a question "the man" would ask

 

[Gold1hunter]

hello all
one question for those that may want to answer, "selling gold" does the transaction find its way to the ATO
cheers all

No!
This is a hobby, some do well but MOST find very little.
If the tax man wanted to start taxing finds they would ALSO have to allow deductions for all associated costs ie. ten thousand dollar machines, accommodation, all travel expenses including spiked tyres, Prospecting clothes, licence, GPS systems, epirbs, picks, pointers, safety glasses, backpacks, sunblock, non metallic boots, snake gaiters, knee pads, 4x4 depreciation, caravan purchases, insurances of vehicle and van and the list goes on.

So if someone went prospecting and found $500 worth of gold they would be able to claim tens of thousands in associated costs and never pay tax on their actual jobs. I don't think THEY'RE (ATO) dumb enough to want the tax from that $500 Nugget.
I'm guessing here but there's probably only 1 in a hundred detectorists that make good money some do ok and most bomb and there are many. thousands of cupboards out there with almost and even new detectors sitting in them because the owners watched a gold show (where there's a lot of staging done) and found that the reality of finding gold is pretty tough, that's a lot of tax benefits.