New Uses for Vermin & Introduced species

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Deepseeker said:
You could be right OldGT. A good cash incentive could be what we need to get on top of pest animals.
Click to expand...

In Victoria we have a fox bounty $10 bucks a cape know a bloke who knocked off 600 last year :perfect: fuel, ammo, rego and insurance covered :) I've got my boy's onto it and they don't drive on the road yet so with a bit of commitment they could do well :beer:
 
Shooting, as in an aerial cull on brumbies or camels can be effective. Being herd animals, whole family groups and large numbers can be eliminated in a short amount of time.
Not so much the case with the likes of foxes and dogs where baiting will account for the majority of kills.

Having a bounty can actually be counter productive.
The lure of the bounty dollar deters a lot of people from laying their allocated bates preferring instead to hopefully shoot or trap them. The trouble is, for every dog you shoot or trap there's 10 you don't get still breeding up.
 
I do remember once many years ago there was a story in the paper about some guy they caught who had set himself up a captive fox breeding program on a large scale, so he could cash in the skins for the bounty. I guess the last thing you want is people farming vermin.

Although, maybe you could net Carp to feed to the Foxes, skin the foxes and collect the bounty on the skins, feed whats left of them after skinning to the "feral" cats you breed, feed the cats to the "wild" dogs you breed, collect the wild dog bounty with their pelts, use whats left of the wild dogs as bait for Carp traps, buy a helicopter gunship with the proceeds and go Camel hunting?

Just a thought :D
 
Deepseeker said:
I do remember once many years ago there was a story in the paper about some guy they caught who had set himself up a captive fox breeding program on a large scale, so he could cash in the skins for the bounty. I guess the last thing you want is people farming vermin.

Although, maybe you could net Carp to feed to the Foxes, skin the foxes and collect the bounty on the skins, feed whats left of them after skinning to the "feral" cats you breed, feed the cats to the "wild" dogs you breed, collect the wild dog bounty with their pelts, use whats left of the wild dogs as bait for Carp traps, buy a helicopter gunship with the proceeds and go Camel hunting?

Just a thought :D
Click to expand...

:8

And live in a BIG shoe !

:)
 
Just came across this today, and it goes some way to explaining a lot of reasons other than the ones that MT has already told us, as to why the feral Camel harvesting idea won't work. Pity really, doesn't seem fair that only MT gets to eat those juicy camel steaks 8.(

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02...-in-central-desert-is-meat-an-option/11917682

Funny thing is, one of the reasons that it's not viable to harvest camels is that you can't transport them two high like you can with cattle (I'd never thought of that before), so basically your transportation costs are double. It's kind of like that old saying I guess, - "Never let a hump get in the way of business" :)
 
G'day

Saw the article on Landline yesterday about the camel culling, that should have the activists all riled up and so it should, some of the people doing the shooting were not crack shots or professional shooters, just cockies who appeared to be just shooting wildly, it was plain to see animals getting wounded and then shot several more times to kill them, cant understand why people would get offended by that scene.

I wonder who qualifies these people to use firearms to kill the animals, when in the army I had to qualify on the range with an Slr to be able to hit a man sized torso at a couple of hundred meters before you were considered proficient, and with practice could easily carry out a head shot at some distance as well, these guys were shooting the poor beasts in the sides and neck from less than a hundred yards away.

The best idea I heard was that they were looking into the setting up of mobile processing plants so that they could cull and process the camels for meat, as there have been many countries interested in buying meat and camel products, so that sounds a way better solution to whats going on now, a very disturbing and poor show message to landline showing that mess in the middle of the day with school kids still on holiday and some probably seeing what I saw.

cheers

stayyerAU
 
You get what you pay for I guess. Culling including getting a "professional" to shoot from the air cost $20k a day in the govt sactioned and funded cull. At best guess Id tend to think the farmers weren't getting paid to shoot animals, even ones causing destruction of fences and watering points.

Didnt catch the program but when youve dealt with pest animals in plauge messing things up you tend to fall on the side of those trying to alleviate the problem.

But its perspective, until its your assets and property being affected its ok to have a moral high ground.
 
Missed it yesterday but just watched it on line.

A few points Stayyer

"some of the people doing the shooting were not crack shots or professional shooters, just cockies who appeared to be just shooting wildly,"

Yes, they were "just cockies". Professional shooters charge professional fees, fees most cockies can ill afford. Most charge travel to and from, fuel, ammunition, accommodation and food. If it's an aerial cull factor in the chopper and pilot.

I can't say I saw any 'just shooting wildly" what I saw was measured aimed shots. Yes it was fast, it has to be if the camels are on the run. Don't forget these blokes are doing it day in and day out, they probably shoot more camels than most professional shooters do.

"it was plain to see animals getting wounded and then shot several more times to kill them, cant understand why people would get offended by that scene."

I saw lots of camels down and then getting shot a 2nd time only, not several more times.
Not sure if you've ever shot a camel, but they are a big unit weighing up to 600kg. Common practise is to shoot them in the neck which paralyzes them instantly and dropping them with the minimum amount of suffering possible. A quick follow up shot into the brain to finish them off.

With an aerial cull, camels running at up to 65kph are shot from above from a moving chopper by "professional" shooters. They are dropped and quite often left paralyzed to die without the 2nd killing shot.

"I wonder who qualifies these people to use firearms to kill the animals,"

The exact same people that qualify you and I to own and use a firearm to kill animals. The exact same people who qualify the "professionals" to own and use a firearm to kill animals.

"when in the army I had to qualify on the range with an Slr to be able to hit a man sized torso at a couple of hundred meters before you were considered proficient, and with practice could easily carry out a head shot at some distance as well, these guys were shooting the poor beasts in the sides and neck from less than a hundred yards away."

Can you carry out a head shot at 65kph? I wouldn't trust myself to be able to, and the moving target was my key event when I represented this country in competitive shooting .
A camels skull has a large ridge that can deflect a 308 projectile if hit front on. Side on a brain shot is fine but it would be irresponsible to go for a brain shot on a moving camel. A slight miss will not kill the camel and the last thing you want is for it to escape into the bush to die in agony.
Again, that is why the neck shot is often the preferred shot. Camel is down allowing for the quick kill shot with no chance of escaping wounded.
With the neck shot, if not paralyzed it is down stunned.

"The best idea I heard was that they were looking into the setting up of mobile processing plants so that they could cull and process the camels for meat, as there have been many countries interested in buying meat and camel products, so that sounds a way better solution to whats going on now,"

No argument there, not from the people featured on the show nor from any other farmer shooting 1000's of rounds a year and leaving the carcasses to rot.
But until that is set up, and they have been trying to for years, there aren't too many options other than drop and rot.

"a very disturbing and poor show message to landline showing that mess in the middle of the day with school kids still on holiday and some probably seeing what I saw."

I disagree. A very good portrayal of what farmers have been screaming out about for years. We need to commercialize the camel meat industry.
As for showing it in the day time, I lost count of the "graphic images coming up" messages emblazoned across the screen before every scene of a dead camel. Hopefully the kids were playing outside like they should be or at least their parents were screening what they watch.

Cheers!
 
I agree OldGT,

I used to drown foxes as I wasn't allowed to use a gun on my two acre property. It was that or keep losing my egg-laying chooks to them. The farmers can only do their best I guess.
 
Camels can be a difficult animal to put down with one shot, it is not unusual to have a close follow up shot to finish them.

But you also dont want them to get away injured and suffer to die.

Didnt see that video, will look for it.

As far as SA goes there are organisations that will come in and cull at their own cost, as long as they have a good idea where the animals are
from the landowner.

The other thing is that the landowner is concerned about shooter welfare too, as their properties are BIG and likely difficult to get assistance
to someone injured or lost.

These organisations are well trained and have all the gear to be independent.

Catch 22 sometimes - $$$ for 'professionals' or Trust someone else

:/
 
Greenhornet_au said:
Camels can be a difficult animal to put down with one shot, it is not unusual to have a close follow up shot to finish them.

:/
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Spot on.

Further on the head shot scenario, while a camels head might be a relatively large target, essentially you're trying to hit a small part the size of your fist that you can't see within that large head.
You're aiming for the centre of an imaginary line you've drawn between his eye and his ear. So you're trying to hit a spot the size of a coin on a moving animal at a distance.

Unlike a small thin skinned kangaroo where any shot to the head with a 308 will leave it without a head, with a camel if you miss that spot but still hit the head, then you've got one seriously injured but alive and adrenaline fuelled in pain camel.
 
Saw the Landline video

https://www.abc.net.au/landline/camel-chaos:-culling-camels-to-protect-water/11921242

Pretty much saw mostly head shots dropping them, finishing shots on the too weak to stand.
Nothing really of bad shooting.

Most landholders are pretty reasonable marksman, some unfortunately get a lot of practice,
and use the same tool on everything from rabbit to camel.

I do how ever think that numbers of camels stated were well below that of the realistic count
by air and satelite over the country, in the millions across the country.

:/
 
Thanks for link. One of the few ABC programs still with some impartial and quality content. Plenty of warning for the squeamish. Couldnt see anything disturbing or outrageous, local abattoir has more grizzly stun and kills.

Sometimes the underlying reason that the animals become an issue in the first place is missed. Severe dry conditions bring these animals in from the wild for easy food and water. These are farmers, with livestock, and in this instance on massive properties.

Its about management, not sporting or leisure shooting. Their primary task is raising animals, and from what I can tell from this presentation they would take another viable option if it was immediately available.

Might do the kids (and others)a bit of good to see things as they really are. Great chance to show them not everything is wonderful and easy. At some point you cant keep them believing in Santa.
 

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