GPZ7000 WM12 Issues In Rain?

[A-team]

Was out today with the wife, we carry a zed each and WM12. Hers is less than 6 months old, mine about 6 years. We were out enjoying some wet weather prospecting but noticed how the 7000 hates the rain. Now I don't mean the ground noise or EMI, we could deal with them through settings.

What we both had a HUGE problem with the detector breaking up with the WM12 - even if they were side by side. It got to the point that they were unusable? Also noticed latency in rainy weather...thoughts, fixes, modifications, ideas and experiences would be appreciated.

It was the first time in the rain/drizzle with these detectors and don't want to be tethered direct by head phone, just not our thing. Would be happy to do more wet weather detecting if we can get around this problem.

 

[Rockhunter62]

Try detecting in WA as it doesn't seem to rain down here in the Kalgoorlie area.

Cheers

Doug

 

[Davent]

I have detected in the rain, in soaked ground with not too many problems with the zed.
I did have a bit of break in sound , but I put it down to the plug from my headphones being a bit dirty in the WM12. It might have been the wet weather. I do have a problem with EMI when it rains though, to the point where I just have to stop. I have not been out for a while because of afternoon storms. Even though it has not rained much this month.
Any way , The grass is too high now and the seed is everywhere, and its called spear grass for a reason, a bit of that stuck in a sock or in the back of a shirt is soooo annoying!!

 

[Lesgold]

Having similar problems with the zed when detecting at the moment. No matter what I do, I cant seem to hold my breath long enough or duck dive deep enough to get a coil on the ground.

 

[aussiefarmer]

You would be better waving a sluice around at the moment

 

[Gem in I]

Booster curly cords have given me a lot of grief that plug into the wm12.
Causing latency problems and intermittent on/off sound.

 

[user 4485]

I don't think your issues are with the GPZ & rain but more likely the WM12 & rain.

Several tech type sites say rain does have an effect on outdoor Wi-Fi signals, "particularly for wireless setups using the 2.4-GHz radio frequency."
They explain "Water droplets absorb this radio frequency and partially block the signal."
This more applies for Wi-Fi over a distance more than what you'd be using your WM12 but still could have an effect on it.

Wireless units can also pick up EMI more readily than the detector itself.
Wouldn't surprise me if that was at least part of the issue given both units were operating the same way.

I've always found with wireless systems short/minimal cables was best. More cables for boosters etc. more chance of issues at weak points. Long runs of cable/curly cables more "antenna" area.
Were you using your homemade booster on both? Another source of possible interference or issues.

The WM12 modules aren't waterproof either so water ingress could be another source of problems.

My advice. If you want to use a "splash/light rain proof" detector in the rain you'd be better of trying headphones wired direct to the detector (even if not ideal) & make sure you have any ingress points well covered. At least you'll still be out there - better you than me. Detecting in the rain or even wet ground on goldfields isn't my idea of fun.

 

[A-team]

Good to see some suggestions here of whats going on with the 7000 and rain. To cover some of the questions;

The wife was running the WM12 with "integrated" amplifier (its a high quality SMD device built in and not separate) - running gaming headphones with a straight cable.

I was running the stock standard WM12 into Grey Ghost headsets.

Both WM12's were themselves dry and in protective WM12 pouches. I tried moving mine to my right hip but the drop outs were the same. The rain was more of a mist to light drizzle, no heavy droplets - but I am now seeing mbasko's point on radio signal absorption could be the key.

Especially considering how weak the signal is even without rain. Turn your body just a little and shadow the two.....equals drop-out. You would thing the transmission signal would be a tad stronger or better thought out.

The latency was a big surprise, I mean like really significant! It certainly made locating the target before digging a challenge. As far as the EMI was concerned, there really wasn't much - the rain clouds gave a small handful of spikes later in the afternoon, but that was it.

The ground noise was the only real issue. We tested the ground - mostly wet to about 4 inches, even after flash flooding from the night before in the area. Loamy soil and decomposed forest matter gave the worst ground noise. Moving on to clay/gravel/wash if you de-tuned a little sensitivity and ran slow without running on the ground, was not bad at all.

I've tried the BlueTooth options but found it completely unworkable, they interfere with each other and give various background noises. I have a few other methods I'm working on (no details yet) as being hooked directly into the detector is one of the reasons I moved away from the GPX.

As for using the 2300 or NOX to me is just wasting $10,000 on a machine that is otherwise very capable - but I guess horses for courses, that's what I get for wanting to detect in the rain?

Luckily my cold was on the mend before we went out, but the wife's was smack bang in the middle of the "bad" period. Right now she is worse than before so plenty of TLC and rest for her.

 

[A-team]

This is from Minelabs documentation:

Wi-Stream (used in CTX 3030 and GPZ 7000 detectors)

Wi-Stream uses efficient low-power digital audio transmission to achieve no perceivable audio time lag (<10 ms) from the CTX 3030 / GPZ 7000 to the WM 10 / WM 12. With multiple channel capability, this wireless technology provides reliable communication with maximum sound quality. Wi-Stream does not transmit audio data, like other technologies (e.g. Bluetooth). Instead packets of data are sent to the WM 10 / WM 12 and then converted to an audio signal within the WM 10 / WM 12. This increases the speed of signals and greatly reduces the effects of electrical noise. The Wi-Stream radio signal is transmitted from the control panel . Therefore, if the CTX 3030 control panel is submerged underwater the radio signal will be blocked by the water and no target signals will be produced from the WM 10 / WM 12.

Wi-Stream Specifications Frequency: 2.4 GHz ISM band (same band as Bluetooth)

Power: <2 mW - transmit from both detector control panel and WM 10 / WM 12

Channels: 14

Wireless compliance standards: ETSI EN 300 440-1: V1.6.1 (2010-08) Electromagnetic Compatibility with Radio Spectrum Matters and ETSI EN 300 440-2: V1.3.1 (2008-11) Electromagnetic Compatibility with Radio Spectrum Matters

Note "2.4 GHz ISM band (same band as Bluetooth)" - but the Bluetooth language seems to not be compatible and presents as various RF noises.

 

[user 4485]

Bluetooth is a totally different wireless technology standard to Minelab's proprietary Wi-Stream system. It's little surprise or wonder they aren't compatible at all.
Even with the GPZ wi-fi turned off Bluetooth units that I tested still suffered from some type of interference with the GPZ? Not sure what causes it?

As Bluetooth is just another (with way more widespread use) RF wireless technology using the 2.4Ghz frequency band I would assume that it would be affected in outdoor use in the same way other 2.4Ghz systems like the WM12 can be.

Maybe try getting your hands on Quest Wirefree Mate to try. Users seem to give them a better review than most other wireless systems. It's not Bluetooth either but Quests own proprietary wireless technology system.

 

[PhaseTech]

Never had a problem with rain, and have detected in some pretty wet weather. The only time I've had WM12 drop-outs or glitching is when my body gets in the way of the signal. Having it on my hip (detector side) it just purrs along. I also have no problem just plugging my sP01 enhancer straight into the Zed when working terrain that I'm not going to get tangled up in.

 

[A-team]

Never had a problem with rain, and have detected in some pretty wet weather. The only time I've had WM12 drop-outs or glitching is when my body gets in the way of the signal. Having it on my hip (detector side) it just purrs along. I also have no problem just plugging my sP01 enhancer straight into the Zed when working terrain that I'm not going to get tangled up in.

We usually wear the WM12 on the left shoulder or left side of chest and works fine except when bending down with your scoop. But yesterday we both suffered exactly the same affect.

We tried relocating the WM12 to the right shoulder, then the right hip, and still both had exactly the same issue. Maybe there was EMI that was interfering with the WM12 2.4ghz signal and not the coil???

I have started working on a 5.8ghz solution today that so-far, with initial testing has performed better than the WM12 with zero latency and no body block issues with the signal. A long way to go before I am 100% field happy with the set-up so will continue testing.

 

[Chewy]

I think Harry Houdini had a problem with his zed and wm a while back. Not sure if he found a reason or not.

 

[Davent]

I had my wm12 in my right shorts pocket last time I went, no problems with it there.(detector side)

 

[Syndyne]

G'day A-team,

I never really use the Zed in rain if I can help it (I know it's a time limit issue for some). Mbasko, Heatho, Reeks, Steveo1 and I have definitely all been caught out at one time or another in the odd, sneaky heavy downpour though! Usually results in a quite fast paced dash to the vehicles :lol: It's also why I carry a large plastic bin liner to cover the Zed at those emergency times. I only use the SDC in wet weather generally as the Zed is not waterproof at all, merely splash resistant at best.

Just having a quick read through here, but did you do a full reset or try a different channel on the initial pairing of the WM12 modules? For some reason mine just works well on channel 4? Not sure if it's a placebo thing or not?

For what it's worth, I also have my module hooked onto the left shoulder strap of my backpack.

Moisture will definitely get into the modules regardless of a protective case or not (I use the DD Leather module case myself). Dampness will get in, even via vapor/condensation with temp changes in wet weather.

If a reset of the Zed and re-pairing of the modules doesn't help, I'd be in contact with Minelab for sure.

Hope you can get it sorted as quickly and smoothly as possible. :Y:

Cheers,
Shauno.