Nuggets forming 'in situ'

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As I read more and more about where best to plan my attack on mum's land.... I've read really interesting things about the notion of nuggets forming in situ by means of specks travelling by water and conglomerating in a certain spot. Coupled with a few other ideal factors. What are peoples thoughts on this compared to through great pressure and force? I haven't posted enough to be able to link... but here's good reading...
Why is Victoria nugget rich?
Conventional thinking insists that gold nuggets originate from quartz reefs where they were formed by the reaction of gold-bearing fluids with chemically reactive (usually carbon-rich) indicator beds adjacent to the reefs. Such thinking cannot explain why the Golden Triangle accounts for more than 90 percent of the nuggets exceeding 500 oz found in the world. Rocks very similar to the sandstones and slates which host the central Victorian gold deposits occur in many goldfields (e.g. Meguma, Canada) and hard-rock masses of gold larger than any reported in Victoria have been found in reefs in New South Wales (e.g. Holtermann Nugget, Hill End- 7,500 oz) and California. Why then are large near-surface nuggets such as occur in the Golden Triangle not found with the same abundance in other goldfields where large masses of gold occur in reefs?The only place in Victoria where a link between reef and near-surface nuggets can be argued with any credibility is Ballarat which produced three-quarters of the state's reef nuggets. The link remains tenuous, however, because the largest mass of gold found in a reef (Lady Don- 600 oz) was only about one-quarter the size of the largest "alluvial" nugget (Welcome- 2,200 oz). In addition, the reef nuggets invariably contained more than 4 percent silver whilst the "alluvial" ones were very pure (e.g. Welcome- 99.2 percent gold).


If conventional thinking cannot explain the facts, old ideas must be abandoned and new hypotheses considered. The possibility that nuggets can grow in situ from groundwater solutions deserves serious consideration. There is ample evidence that gold can be transported in solution and deposited elsewhere under the low-temperature, low-pressure conditions which prevail at the Earth's surface. Such evidence includes a brass cartridge lying in mine water being completely replaced by gold (Tasmania), a $20 gold coin being recovered from a stream after several decades coated in gold crystals (Alaska), gold impregnations in coal and fossilised wood (Ballarat), gold inside a fossil shell (Croydon, Queensland) and iron concretions in a nugget identical to those in the surrounding soil (Coolgardie, W.A.).

What would be required to grow a large nugget in situ? The basic requirements appear to be:

1. a source of gold

2. a means of dissolving the gold and holding it in a stable form in the groundwater for transportation (probably over considerable distances)

3. steady delivery of dissolved gold to a precipitation site for a long time

4. some nucleating material and a precipitation mechanism.

How could these requirements have been met within the Golden Triangle? A source of gold is no problem given the number of reefs present. The most likely experimentally-proven reaction whereby gold in the reefs could have been dissolved involves chloride and hydrogen ions and oxygen: salt, acid and air in layperson's terms. Salt could have been concentrated in groundwater by evaporation when an arid climate prevailed. Acid could have been produced by the weathering of pyrite (iron sulphide) which is abundant in Victorian reefs. Air would have been present within the pores of the weathered rock above the watertable (the surface below which all the spaces in the rock are filled with water).

Steady delivery of gold to a precipitation site would require a very stable watertable (i.e. one not moving up and down very much). This would entail a low rainfall, a flat land surface and a lack of earth movements. The fact that within a particular area (e.g. Rheola) many nuggets occur at the same depth (and not always on the bottom) could reflect their growth at the same old watertable level. Agents which could cause gold to precipitate include copper, gold, organic matter (such as buried logs) and iron (in the ferrous state).

It can be argued that the Golden Triangle was unique in its ability to grow nuggets for the following reasons:

1. the reefs contained pyrite which weathered to form sulphuric acid

2. the acid was not neutralised because there was little carbonate present in either the reefs or their host rocks

3. at some stage during the Tertiary period (perhaps 5 million years ago) central Victoria had a climate sufficiently arid to generate saline groundwater (it is interesting to note that the distribution of nuggets within Victoria mirrors the distribution of saline groundwater even today)

4. at the same time central Victoria was very flat and free of significant earth movements (the Kosciusko Uplift had not begun) so that the watertable was very stable

5. the region contained iron-rich rocks (e.g. basalt at Ballarat, gabbro at Rheola) to aid precipitation of gold.

If nuggets did grow in situ at old watertables there is a possibility that predictive methods can be used in their location. It should be possible to plot old watertables on cross sections using reported nugget depths. Such surfaces are probably fairly regular (similar to the land surface at the time) but may have been tilted from the horizontal or disrupted by faulting during the Kosciusko Uplift. The trick is to find the intersection of an auriferous old watertable with the present surface in an area where nobody has taken a metal detector yet. The other advice for prospectors is to pay particular attention to areas where iron-rich rocks occur.
 
This argument will be around for years to come, world is flat, world is round sort of stuff. I like the way you think and research....then just have to come up with your own theory. In 100 years they may laugh at us, don't ever trust common theories as they are usually wrong!
 
Very interesting, I like it when people keep an open mind and don't assume that those before them are always right.
 
The CSIRO did testing on large nuggets and came to the conclusion that these large nuggets were formed a depth with high temperatures by their crystal structure. I can only presume that depth means Mesothermal or volcanic ?

I don't think any one has the true answer, but its always a good topic to discuss. :)
 
I would like to put in my opinion that the nuggets are formed in reefs,
I recall a Catalyst story on research into nuggets which indicated that the temperature at which the gold nuggets crystallised was in the region of about 300 degrees centigrade. (If you have any doubt that nuggets are crystalline cut one in half ouch! etch it with acid and you will see a crystalline structure of a sort similar to the widmanstatten pattern inside iron meteorites which is indicative of a metallic crystalline structure). An article on this can be found by googling Catalyst gold nugget.
Formation at that temperature generally rules out near surface sites for the formation of nuggets in situ. It also does not support an extremely hot igneous (volcanic) source for gold nuggets. Rather it supports formation of nuggets by hot fluids circulating at temperatures of up to 300 degrees and at significant depth but no more than 12km and probably less.
Victorian goldfields are characterised by around 5 km of 400 million year old deep ocean sedimentary deposits (Ordovician slates). These slates have been compressed sideways into long north/south corrugations by tectonic forces and much cracked and fissured along the axes of the corrugations. Intrusions of magmatic material has provided hot fluids which have circulated in theses cracks and fissures and deposited their minerals, quartz and gold as reefs and leaders when they reach the Cinderella zone of the right temperature, pressure and chemical conditions. Intersections and changes of fluid paths (Indicators) change these conditions enough to allow for large nuggets to form. These indicators are apparently analogous to the way opals (I am told) frequently form at the intersection of vertical cracks and horizontal floors.
The Ordovician slates are about 5 km thick but originally would have been much thicker allowing for compression. It is difficult to say how much has been lost to erosion but 400 million years suggests that many more km would have been lost. There is plenty of depth scope for nugget formation. It is this particular rock history which gives the golden triangle its gift of nuggets. I cannot comment on conditions in other states or elsewhere in the world.
An in situ secondary deposit theory for the production of the majority of our nuggets would also not be consistent with their usefulness as a guide to prospecting for primary deposits when we know that they are a very good guide.
I do not doubt that gold can form in situ as I have seen it for myself. When drilling a bore on the Loddon Deep Lead down stream of some of the major golden triangle goldfields, we encountered gravel, pyrites with very fine gold particles adhering to the solid particles. The gold was so fine as to be unpannable. The gold was also uniformly fine indicating equilibrium between solution and deposition and there was no indication that would suggest the particles would grow further in size in the wet environment. The reason the bores were drilled was for a company to examine the feasibility of Solution Mining whereby weak cyanide solution would be pumped down one bore and pumped out another downstream and the gold precipitated out of solution. It was eventually knocked on the head by the government.
In 400 million years the topography of the goldfields has changed greatly with periods of mountain building, massive erosion caused by high rainfall on land devoid of vegetation, vulcanism, glaciation, inundation, shifting watercourse, desertification in the eons before the current conditions.
Where all the nuggets are now is, as a result, much of a mystery and I am glad of it as smarter people than me would have worked it all out and found them by now.
 
Gold can and does form in situ from the mineralised waters underground and to prove it does just look at the cyanide process where gold is liquified and then tuned back into gold they are still doing it today and were doing it years ago too there is an article on one of the gold sites about gold precipitation and if i can find it again I will post it here
 
Aqua Regia which is 3parts Hydrochloric Acid and 1 part Nitric Acid will dissolve Gold in to a solution known as Auric Chloride I think or Chloro Auric Acid. Then precipitation is done with Sodium Meta-bi sulphate. All this can occur at room temperature, though other methods and chemicals can do similar at higher temps and pressures and precipitate onto different minerals such as carbonates. This is why Gold can be trapped in Sulphides also until oxidization occurs and the Gold is liberated as free Gold.

This is the reason that reefs above the water table have free Gold in the oxidized zone and below the water table are the Sulphide types where Oxygen cannot reach.

Also read up on enrichment zones and deletion zones in the Victorian Goldfields and Gold forming in situ percolating in the ground makes a lot more sense.
 
Precisely guys....Gold forming in situ is what we now term as Secondary Gold.

Secondary Gold forms at, or near, the earths surface from gold re-dissolved from a nearby Primary Gold source which has been exposed by millions of years of weathering and erosion, at or above the water table in saline groundwater.

Some small quantities of the Primary Gold dissolves in the 'near surface' salty groundwater, and is carried downslope under gravity (in solution), and is then re-deposited near the ground surface at the water table.

It is more common however, for Secondary gold deposition from saline ground water solutions, to occur as a result of ground water dilution from rainwater.

In other words, once the salinity level begins to drop, this re-dissolved Sec golds solubility begins to drop dramatically and it crystallizes.

Tens of millions of rainfall events over only the last few million years, repeat this process thus building up more and more layers of gold "In Situ" to form gold nuggets.

Secondary gold is very young, and is still forming today after rainfall events.

It is also one of the main, or should be the main interest of prospectors today.....especially those with a Metal Detector!

Regards
 
The PMAV posted an article

Why is Victoria Nugget rich?

see: http://www.pmav.org.au/stories-a-reports/triangle-gold

interesting reading. Note well "The trick is to find the intersection of an auriferous old watertable with the present surface in an area where nobody has taken a metal detector yet. The other advice for prospectors is to pay particular attention to areas where iron-rich rocks occur."
 
also see the following articles. this debate, as far as I can see, is far from settled. there are several unexplained nuggets in odd locations reported over the years. several theories - dropped, carried by Aboriginal tribes, formed in situ etc etc. If you troll through some of the Uni sites, Adelaide Uni did a lot of work over in the GT some years ago, you will find many interesting articles on gold formation theories. As an aside, about 7 years or so ago we did some work with them. really nice blokes and down to earth, especially after a few frothies. funny to watch the gold fever take over when out patch hunting for samples. we did get into a debate about Indicators, but that's a whole other topic.

http://www.ga.gov.au/image_cache/GA5409.pdf

http://nla.gov.au/nla.map-rm2336

http://www.crocoite.com/anzminerals/minerals/gold/goldvic.html

http://museumvictoria.com.au/discoverycentre/infosheets/gold-nuggets/
 
cheers HHD - the map in the original is OKish, pretty broad though. Hope your research is going OK. Somewhere in the deep recesses of the internet is an old document on the list of nuggets in Vic, at what depth and where. very good read and a good guide. really puts into perspective that the some of the bigger nuggets were deemed as shallow but are still out of detecting range - usually anything right up to 6 feet deep was deemed as 'shallow'. also explains that some nuggets get caught/trapped in hard red clay layers as opposed to hitting bedrock which is generally considered the norm. the whole big nugget theory still gets thrown into chaos when you consider big GT nuggets compared to the big Ballarat nuggets. GT - usually 'shallow'- Ballarat - 'deep'.

Examples around Dunolly:

Goldsborough - Nuggety Gully. 73 oz at 3 feet. 70 and 60 oz at 4 feet. 204 oz at 3 feet
Old Lead - 440 oz at 5 feet. 324 oz at 40 feet.
Wanyarra - 82oz at 14 feet

the list goes on. I have spent ages plotting nuggets onto maps. does my head in at times.
 
Some recording of recent finds:

funayb.jpg


Wedderburn area prior to 1900:

2lwx6dw.jpg
 
Man that's incredible metamorphic. would have never have know those nuggets were ever dug up.I'm impressed with your research, far above my Google abilities.keep it up
 

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