Fridge Power Vs Loading Vs Covers,

[Ridge Runner]

I just found this Video from a Guy In Aus and it is pretty Conclusive, This would explain why I have not been able to replicate my first fridge tests and why my Little Dometic is efficient when it come to power draw,

This Video confirms what many of us have said all along but there was no proof until now,

Enjoy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9xjYKs1Kx4

 

[bicter]

Here's a thread form a while back on caravbanners forum discussing the video and covers https://www.caravanersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=111&t=86778&p=1325127&hilit=cover#p1325127

 

[Ridge Runner]

Here's a thread form a while back on caravbanners forum discussing the video and covers https://www.caravanersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=111&t=86778&p=1325127&hilit=cover#p1325127

I can't access that site because they don't want anyone overseas reading anything, SOB's.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Well the Guy in the Video is right, I have my ARB 47L set to 2*c and it was taking between 16 to 17.5+ minutes to Cycle, I took the cover and opened it to fix a remote thermometer in there So I had it wide open for 3 or 5 minutes, Then I closed it and about half an hour later it fired up and it only ran for 13m 46s So that will save about a third of an Amp per cycle,

Last week when I checked it it was using between 0,717Ah to 0.75Ah on 12v DC, And at about 25h 44m it was using 19.394Ah which means it was using 0.75366261221 Ah as it settled down over 24 hours, I don't think there will be much difference in the Tamp variations but the Ah will drop because the run times are 3 to 4 minutes shorter.

Anyways I will rerun the Test without the Cover on It and see what happens.

 

[Nightjar]

RR,
Know doubt you already know with your detailed research/experiments but I was amazed the difference covers make.
My "old yellow" Engel still purring along, but maybe not as quite. Had a woolen blanket lined canvas cover made up for it when first purchased back in '83.
Rides in the back of the ute which has canvas cover. When prospecting I usually roll up the flaps for easy access to detectors etc.
One day I left a car seat cushion on the lid and when I returned a few hours later I checked both fridges temperature and was surprised to see old yellas freeze temperature had gone down to -13C usually hovering around -06C. Removed the cushion and a few hours later the temp had crept back up.
After arriving back home, dragged out the sewing machine and lined the lid flap of the cover with a sheep skin.
With the control knob set so the fridge cycles it constantly runs at between -06C & -10C. :Y: erfect:

 

[condor22]

My Engel has had a cover on it since I bought it near 29 years ago. In the rear of the 4x4, the cover keeps direct sunlight off the metal casing.

Does it keep it cooler or not? I don't know. Does it use less/more power? again I don't know, as it's covered all the time and I've never checked.

However, it has kept the fridge protected to the extent that from the outside it still looks like a new fridge. So apart from function, it's doing its job, protecting my investment. :beer:

 

[Ridge Runner]

RR,
Know doubt you already know with your detailed research/experiments but I was amazed the difference covers make.
My "old yellow" Engel still purring along, but maybe not as quite. Had a woolen blanket lined canvas cover made up for it when first purchased back in '83.
Rides in the back of the ute which has canvas cover. When prospecting I usually roll up the flaps for easy access to detectors etc.
One day I left a car seat cushion on the lid and when I returned a few hours later I checked both fridges temperature and was surprised to see old yellas freeze temperature had gone down to -13C usually hovering around -06C. Removed the cushion and a few hours later the temp had crept back up.
After arriving back home, dragged out the sewing machine and lined the lid flap of the cover with a sheep skin.
With the control knob set so the fridge cycles it constantly runs at between -06C & -10C. :Y: erfect:

Well covering the Lid is a great Idea but as for the factory covers The problem with them is because the Mesh restricts the Air Flow, And that is what messes with the Temps and the power the fridge uses, Insulating the top like you did is a Top Idea So thanks for that and I will leave the Lid Cover fitted as normal, Please checkout the Final Engel Results in the Link Below, Thanks again for the Lid Tip, :Y:

 

[Ridge Runner]

My Engel has had a cover on it since I bought it near 29 years ago. In the rear of the 4x4, the cover keeps direct sunlight off the metal casing.

Does it keep it cooler or not? I don't know. Does it use less/more power? again I don't know, as it's covered all the time and I've never checked.

However, it has kept the fridge protected to the extent that from the outside it still looks like a new fridge. So apart from function, it's doing its job, protecting my investment. :beer:

Well here is the final results with the Engel 75L Twin/Combi in Ambient Temps of 35*c and an IN Vehicle Temp of 57.5*c.

The Cover does add to the thermal thermal properties of fridge But the Mesh needs to be removed so the cooling area can breath,

This really Answers any doubts,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fhnGbGyZVg

My Fridge set @ 2*c has just done it's first cycle with the cover off and you won't believe the drop in power it has used. :inlove: :Y:

 

[Nightjar]

My Fridge set @ 2*c has just done it's first cycle with the cover off and you won't believe the drop in power it has used. :inlove: :Y:

Who would have thought the fridge covers actually cause a hike in power usage?
Hasn't convinced me enough to remove covers but will probably remove mesh on the 60 or is it 80L Engel.
May remove the cover on the old 39L Engel to see if as Condo mentions it still looks like new considering it has been in place for 38 years.

**Still scratching head why 39L freezer temp dropped when I inadvertantly left the cushion on the lid?**

 

[Ridge Runner]

My Fridge set @ 2*c has just done it's first cycle with the cover off and you won't believe the drop in power it has used. :inlove: :Y:

Who would have thought the fridge covers actually cause a hike in power usage?
Hasn't convinced me enough to remove covers but will probably remove mesh on the 60 or is it 80L Engel.
May remove the cover on the old 39L Engel to see if as Condo mentions it still looks like new considering it has been in place for 38 years.

**Still scratching head why 39L freezer temp dropped when I inadvertantly left the cushion on the lid?**

Well according to that Video the cover dose help slow the warm up rate of the fridge, but thats all it does,

It's Only been just over 4 hours since I took the cover off and I'm already saving over an Amp and I've saved 10.9Wh already So I Cut the Mesh off the Cover Vents and put the cover back on.

So far my Hourly Amp Draw has gone down from 0.753Ah down to 0.604Ah and coz it's only been just over 4 hours it is still Dropping, I reckon that the 24hr draw will go from 17.5Ah down to around 13Ah at the rate it is dropping and maybe a bit more once it has had a chance to settle,

Fingers crossed Ay, but I can see a vast difference already, It's that Mesh that is causing all the trouble because it's On cycle is 2 or 3 minutes less than what it was before I touched it, I worked out I should get another 28 hours from one of my 115Ah batteries on avarage maybe more when it settles from me messing with it.

EDIT:- It's hour;y Draw has now dropped down to 0.5581Ah per hour It's on cycle is around 14m 50s and it's off cycle is around 77m 40s , The current used during it's on cycle was .851Ah and the total cycle was 92m 33s Divide 0.851 / 92.55 = 0.5581Ah per hour and it's still dropping after 5h 54m 7s, So it has gone from 0.753Ah down to 0.558Ah just from removing those mesh screens which is .2 of an Amp or a 5th of an Amp per hour. :inlove: erfect:

 

[Nightjar]

Too technical for me RR, just as long as my foods frozen and the beers cold. erfect:
Bought and played around with the Peltier setup a while back, (there is a thread on here somewhere.)
Have the unit set up so it can be fixed to the cooling area and blow cool air into the workings of the 39litre Engel, to date I haven't used it out on the field.
Filled in quite a few hours in the shed putting it together but the amp draw would probably out weigh the cooling effect?
Do not have the technical knowledge you have to test.

**The first pic shows a gutter fitted to direct condensation away from the electrics, had thoughts about collecting it for "survival" water," hard to see but there is a tube poking out RH side." layful:

 

[Ridge Runner]

Too technical for me RR, just as long as my foods frozen and the beers cold. erfect:
Bought and played around with the Peltier setup a while back, (there is a thread on here somewhere.)
Have the unit set up so it can be fixed to the cooling area and blow cool air into the workings of the 39litre Engel, to date I haven't used it out on the field.
Filled in quite a few hours in the shed putting it together but the amp draw would probably out weigh the cooling effect?
Do not have the technical knowledge you have to test.

**The first pic shows a gutter fitted to direct condensation away from the electrics, had thoughts about collecting it for "survival" water," hard to see but there is a tube poking out RH side." layful:

https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/1414/1628670554_peltier_set_up._004.jpg
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/1414/1628670554_peltier_set_up._003.jpg
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/1414/1628670554_peltier_set_up._002.jpg
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/1414/1628670555_peltier_set_up._001.jpg
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/1414/1628670555_peltier.jpg
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/1414/1628670555_peltier3.jpg
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/1414/1628670556_peltier2.jpg
https://www.prospectingaustralia.com/forum/img/member-images/1414/1628670556_peltier4.jpg

Thats a good Idea but the petlier part of it might draw a few Amps normally between 3.5 to about 4.7Ah

If you could wire In just the Fan that would reduce the power draw to less than half an Amp, If you wired it up to the existing fan it would turn on and off when the fridge powered up and then it would lower the power the fridge uses, The Guy in that Video just used a 12" /300mm room fan and he saw a big difference, So using the fan you have there will more than do the job, But just use that little fan without the petlier part and you will lower the current draw by about 90% so then it will lower the overall power draw,

To work out the Maths is easy, because you have to convert it to Decimals As In numbers 1 to 10 then you can workout what the fridge is doing on a calculator.

To work out the time take 60 minutes and divide it by 10 = 6, So every 6 minutes equals 0.1 of an hour, and every 6 seconds is 0.1 of a minute

If you are working out using hours and minutes it works like this

Each Minute equals just on 0.0165, 2 mins = 0.033, 3 mins = 0.050, 4mins = 0.066, 5 = 0.0883 and 6 minutes = 0.1 and that also works when it comes to using Minutes and seconds.

So if your fridge has a on and off cycle of 92 minutes 36 seconds , Remembering that every 6 minutes OR every 6 Seconds = 0.1 the complete duty cycle /On-Off Cycle converts to 92.6

If your fridge runs for 11mins 39 seconds it converts to 11.65 because you have 11 minute and you know every 6 seconds = 0.1 so 36 seconds = 0.6 and the remaining 3 = 0.050 so when you put them all together you get 11.65 minutes.

OR if it ha run for 17m 23s it has run for 17.3883 minutes. because you have 17mins, and 0.3 =18seconds and the 5 remaining seconds = 0.0883 SO piece it all together and you get 17.3883 minutes, If it had been 17m 24s then it would come to 17.4 minutes.

To work out what it's hourly Ah rate is Say that it has just run and used 0.706Ah on the meter and its ON -OFF cycle was 92m 36 seconds, TAKE the 0.706Ah /Divide it by 92.6 = 0.00762419006Ah X by 60 minutes = 0.4574514036 Ah per hour OR it is averaging 0.457Ah per hour to workout what it is using per day X the 0.457Ah by 24hours means it is using 10.978Ah per day.

To Avoid all the excess numbers above etc and your fridge has done an On and off cycle of 1hr 32 mins convert it to 92mins and take that 0.706Ah and divide it by 92 = 0.00767391304 X it by 60 minutes = 0.460Ah OR 0.4604347824Ah per hour and that is the quickest way.

Hope that helps :Y:

 

[Nightjar]

 

[condor22]

Yup, in 29 years I've only ever seen the Engel go up in temp when;

1. I stuffed up n left the oven on destroying the battery, the temp increase alerted me.
2. The fuse blew due to an unknown connector issue, the temp increase alerted me.
3. The connector issue arose again, was fixed, again...............
4. The Fridge switch went wheels up, was replaced, again, blah blah......

As I always have enough power and have not tested any variable, the cover/mesh has had no apparent affect on fridge performance, after all it is an Engel.

Like us oldies say, if aint broke, don't fix it.

 

[Ridge Runner]

https://www.prospectingaustralia.co...ages/1414/1628682106_wtf-mate-wtf-is-that.jpg

Yeah mate it gets like that went you get in to it,

Removing that mesh has done the trick, If you don't do anything else I would remove the mesh coz it has lowered the power draw for sure, It's cycling on and off between 88 and 94 minutes at the moment and only using 0.6Ah.

I could never work out why it never worked like it did when I first got it, then I added the cover and that made it chew more power and I tried every thing but I never thought about those flaming screens, Still it's sorted now I might have a go at the 78L next, It's always been good but removing the mesh can only make it better,

the 47L has been running non stop for 5 years and 5 months so I can't complain.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Yup, in 29 years I've only ever seen the Engel go up in temp when;

1. I stuffed up n left the oven on destroying the battery, the temp increase alerted me.
2. The fuse blew due to an unknown connector issue, the temp increase alerted me.
3. The connector issue arose again, was fixed, again...............
4. The Fridge switch went wheels up, was replaced, again, blah blah......

As I always have enough power and have not tested any variable, the cover/mesh has had no apparent affect on fridge performance, after all it is an Engel.

Like us oldies say, if aint broke, don't fix it.

Well that guy in the video surprized me, But he's spot on, His Engel results match mine, the other thing I don't like about the ARB covers is if you touch them with your hand your skin makes white marks on them, The Blue cover of the 47 looks like faded Denim, and the Black and Grey cover on the 78 is not the perfect colour either.

 

[condor22]

I bought my cover when I bought the fridge, they are the same age.

Grey, zips still work and nothing has frayed or gone brittle, they don't make em like that anymore, lol.

 

[Ridge Runner]

I bought my cover when I bought the fridge, they are the same age.

Grey, zips still work and nothing has frayed or gone brittle, they don't make em like that anymore, lol.

Yeah ARB covers are proper Canvas and need to be changed to something Wipeable, they are Tough but the material is all wrong for dusty envirinments,

Cutting out those screens has given back 21.993% of the Daily Power Draw, So I am saving 22% per day, For just over 4 Days I get an extra day for Free,

At 0.753 I was averaging 18.0879Ah not 17.5Ah,

I have left the cover on but just removed the screens. :Y:

 

[Reeks]

hey ridgerunner do you have a picture of the mesh you removed? I just checked my cover and the mesh looks quite large

 

[Ridge Runner]

hey ridgerunner do you have a picture of the mesh you removed? I just checked my cover and the mesh looks quite large

Yep Here ya Go,